WEBVTT

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<v speaker_0>Start recording.

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<v speaker_1>Okay.

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<v speaker_0>Um, the first thing

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<v speaker_0>we'll start with

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<v speaker_0>is tell me your

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<v speaker_0>name and your

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<v speaker_0>pronouns.

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<v speaker_1>Hey, my name is

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<v speaker_1>Donna Johnson, AKA

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<v speaker_1>Blaze, AKA Motorcycle

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<v speaker_1>Donna, and my pronouns

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<v speaker_1>are she and

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<v speaker_1>her.

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<v speaker_0>Okay, thank you. So

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<v speaker_0>let's go ahead

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<v speaker_0>and get started. You've

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<v speaker_0>mentioned a little

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<v speaker_0>bit prior to this

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<v speaker_0>about the 1980s,

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<v speaker_0>um, your coming out

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<v speaker_0>story. Where do

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<v speaker_0>you want to get

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<v speaker_0>started? Where do

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<v speaker_0>you feel is the

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<v speaker_0>best place to

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<v speaker_0>begin?

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<v speaker_1>Well, I think we

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<v speaker_1>should always start

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<v speaker_1>at the beginning.

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<v speaker_0>Okay. Let's hear the

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<v speaker_0>story.

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<v speaker_1>Yeah. All right. So

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<v speaker_1>it was the

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<v speaker_1>summer of 1977,

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<v speaker_1>and, uh, I was

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<v speaker_1>a camp counselor

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<v speaker_1>at a church camp

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<v speaker_1>in Port A.

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<v speaker_1>And, uh, one of

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<v speaker_1>the women, the

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<v speaker_1>two women that were

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<v speaker_1>like lifeguards there,

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<v speaker_1>and they stayed the

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<v speaker_1>whole summer, so

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<v speaker_1>I just went for

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<v speaker_1>a week. Um,

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<v speaker_1>but uh, my first

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<v speaker_1>night there she

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<v speaker_1>invited me down to

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<v speaker_1>their cabin and

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<v speaker_1>I went and, um,

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<v speaker_1>things progressed from

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<v speaker_1>there. Uh, and so

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<v speaker_1>I spent this

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<v speaker_1>whole week,

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<v speaker_1>um, every night

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<v speaker_1>in this cabin.

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<v speaker_1>Uh, and then I

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<v speaker_1>left and went

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<v speaker_1>home.

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<v speaker_1>And then I was

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<v speaker_1>really confused,

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<v speaker_1>uh, about it all.

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<v speaker_1>And I always

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<v speaker_1>knew I was different,

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<v speaker_1>and I'd always

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<v speaker_1>been attracted to women,

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<v speaker_1>uh, and not

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<v speaker_1>really to men, but

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<v speaker_1>I tried to

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<v speaker_1>be attracted to men.

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<v speaker_1>Because again, you

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<v speaker_1>know, I'm a teenager

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<v speaker_1>in, in the

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<v speaker_1>'70s, um,

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<v speaker_1>so, um,

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<v speaker_1>was very, very confused.

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<v speaker_1>And so I

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<v speaker_1>went into my senior

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<v speaker_1>year

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<v speaker_1>having had this experience

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<v speaker_1>and I was,

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<v speaker_1>well, I was very

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<v speaker_1>confused. And

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<v speaker_1>so there was a

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<v speaker_1>gay man, two

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<v speaker_1>gay men that I

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<v speaker_1>knew of that...

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<v speaker_1>they're in my little

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<v speaker_1>town of Refugio,

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<v speaker_1>Texas. Um,

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<v speaker_1>George and I

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<v speaker_1>don't know, I can't

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<v speaker_1>remember George's last

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<v speaker_1>name, but Chris Barber

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<v speaker_1>and, uh, also

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<v speaker_1>known as Ada Wilson.

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<v speaker_1>Uh,

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<v speaker_1>so I went... And

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<v speaker_1>they were just

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<v speaker_1>big gossips too, you

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<v speaker_1>know? Uh, but

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<v speaker_1>I went to the

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<v speaker_1>salon, uh,

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<v speaker_1>and said, "I,

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<v speaker_1>I really need to

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<v speaker_1>talk to you

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<v speaker_1>guys, and you're the

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<v speaker_1>only people I

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<v speaker_1>know that I can

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<v speaker_1>talk to." And

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<v speaker_1>I told them what

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<v speaker_1>had happened.

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<v speaker_1>And they said the

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<v speaker_1>kindest thing to

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<v speaker_1>me. They, they

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<v speaker_1>said, "You know, just

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<v speaker_1>because you had

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<v speaker_1>this experience, that doesn't

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<v speaker_1>mean that you're

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<v speaker_1>actually gay.

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<v speaker_1>You get to decide."

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<v speaker_1>

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<v speaker_1>And so I was

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<v speaker_1>like, "Oh, okay."

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<v speaker_1>So because I did

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<v speaker_1>not wanna be

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<v speaker_1>gay

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<v speaker_1>because my, you know,

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<v speaker_1>it was just

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<v speaker_1>not the right time

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<v speaker_1>in the world

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<v speaker_1>to be gay. Um,

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<v speaker_1>it was

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<v speaker_1>terrible. Uh,

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<v speaker_1>so anyway, but

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<v speaker_1>I graduated from high

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<v speaker_1>school and, um,

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<v speaker_1>met a woman immediately

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<v speaker_1>and got involved

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<v speaker_1>in a relationship.

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<v speaker_1>I wanna back up

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<v speaker_1>from that just

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<v speaker_1>a little bit too.

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<v speaker_1>I mean, the

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<v speaker_1>'70s were a really

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<v speaker_1>hard time, uh,

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<v speaker_1>especially in a small

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<v speaker_1>town. And for

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<v speaker_1>me, my father was

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<v speaker_1>a politician and

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<v speaker_1>a big politician. Uh,

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<v speaker_1>so for me

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<v speaker_1>to step out of

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<v speaker_1>line in any

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<v speaker_1>way was just not

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<v speaker_1>an okay thing

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<v speaker_1>to do. Um,

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<v speaker_1>but anyway, but I

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<v speaker_1>met a woman

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<v speaker_1>and, uh, you know,

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<v speaker_1>the rest is

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<v speaker_1>history. But

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<v speaker_1>[laughs] in,

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<v speaker_1>I think,

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<v speaker_1>1979,

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<v speaker_1>I wanted to come

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<v speaker_1>out to my

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<v speaker_1>parents and I came

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<v speaker_1>out to my

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<v speaker_1>sister first.

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<v speaker_1>And she was a

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<v speaker_1>born again Christian,

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<v speaker_1>had become a born

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<v speaker_1>again Christian by

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<v speaker_1>this time. And

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<v speaker_1>my sister had married

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<v speaker_1>a Black man

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<v speaker_1>in 1972, and you

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<v speaker_1>know that went

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<v speaker_1>over like a tuna

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<v speaker_1>fish bunch at

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<v speaker_1>a wedding. Um, so

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<v speaker_1>[laughs] when they

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<v speaker_1>were dating in high

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<v speaker_1>school, I helped

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<v speaker_1>her sneak out of

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<v speaker_1>the house, right?

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<v speaker_1>So talking to my

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<v speaker_1>sister and she

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<v speaker_1>says, "Look, I don't

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<v speaker_1>really agree with

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<v speaker_1>your lifestyle, but I

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<v speaker_1>owe you."

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<v speaker_1>Uh, "So I am

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<v speaker_1>gonna pave the

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<v speaker_1>way for you with

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<v speaker_1>Mom."

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<v speaker_1>And so, and she

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<v speaker_1>did. And so

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<v speaker_1>I came out to

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<v speaker_1>my mom first,

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<v speaker_1>and my mom just,

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<v speaker_1>you know, my

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<v speaker_1>mom was so great.

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<v speaker_1>She just loved

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<v speaker_1>me, and all she

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<v speaker_1>wanted was for

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<v speaker_1>me to be happy.

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<v speaker_1>So I was

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<v speaker_1>really grateful for that.

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<v speaker_1>Um, you know,

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<v speaker_1>she told me years

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<v speaker_1>later, she said,

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<v speaker_1>"I always knew you

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<v speaker_1>were different. Mothers

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<v speaker_1>know." And

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<v speaker_1>I'm so grateful

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<v speaker_1>that, you know, my

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<v speaker_1>mother never did

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<v speaker_1>anything to break my

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<v speaker_1>spirit, to try

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<v speaker_1>to bend me to

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<v speaker_1>be w-who I

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<v speaker_1>was not. You know,

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<v speaker_1>we had to

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<v speaker_1>make a deal, uh,

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<v speaker_1>when I was

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<v speaker_1>small, like first, second

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<v speaker_1>grade, um, 'cause

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<v speaker_1>I just wanted to

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<v speaker_1>wear my boots

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<v speaker_1>and jeans, right? You

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<v speaker_1>know, uh, I

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<v speaker_1>just wanted to hang

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<v speaker_1>out with all

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<v speaker_1>the guys. And

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<v speaker_1>so we had to

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<v speaker_1>make a deal

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<v speaker_1>where I could wear

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<v speaker_1>my boots and

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<v speaker_1>jeans on Tuesdays and

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<v speaker_1>Thursdays, but I

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<v speaker_1>had to wear a

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<v speaker_1>dress or a

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<v speaker_1>skirt Monday, Wednesday, and

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<v speaker_1>Fridays, but I

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<v speaker_1>could wear my boots.

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<v speaker_1>So,

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<v speaker_1>uh, anyway, so then

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<v speaker_1>I came out

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<v speaker_1>to my father the

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<v speaker_1>same day.

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<v speaker_1>And, um, my

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<v speaker_1>father did not

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<v speaker_1>want me to

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<v speaker_1>even finish the sentence.

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<v speaker_1>He did not

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<v speaker_1>wanna hear the word

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<v speaker_1>lesbian. Uh,

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<v speaker_1>he just took

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<v speaker_1>my hand and he

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<v speaker_1>says, "I know.

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<v speaker_1>I understand. You know,

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<v speaker_1>you've been hanging

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<v speaker_1>out with that Janie

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<v speaker_1>Hurd."Another notorious

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<v speaker_1>lesbian, uh, much older

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<v speaker_1>than me. And

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<v speaker_1>he said, "That's fine.

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<v speaker_1>Whatever. Just don't

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<v speaker_1>do that here."

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<v speaker_1>And I said, "Yes,

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<v speaker_1>sir."

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<v speaker_1>Uh, and so that

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<v speaker_1>was that. And

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<v speaker_1>that was the last

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<v speaker_1>time my father

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<v speaker_1>and I ever spoke

00:06:28.344 --> 00:06:30.444
<v speaker_1>about it. Um,

00:06:31.504 --> 00:06:33.124
<v speaker_1>so there's my big

00:06:33.124 --> 00:06:34.724
<v speaker_1>coming out story.

00:06:34.724 --> 00:06:36.264
<v speaker_1>Um, it-

00:06:36.264 --> 00:06:37.084
<v speaker_2>How did you find

00:06:37.084 --> 00:06:38.584
<v speaker_2>community through that?

00:06:38.584 --> 00:06:39.324
<v speaker_2>So thinking about it

00:06:39.324 --> 00:06:40.484
<v speaker_2>being the '70s,

00:06:40.484 --> 00:06:41.634
<v speaker_2>knowing that the gentleman

00:06:41.634 --> 00:06:41.724
<v speaker_2>at-

00:06:41.724 --> 00:06:42.264
<v speaker_1>Right

00:06:42.264 --> 00:06:42.734
<v speaker_2>... the spa, or

00:06:42.734 --> 00:06:43.823
<v speaker_2>the salon rather,

00:06:43.824 --> 00:06:44.334
<v speaker_2>were-

00:06:44.334 --> 00:06:44.844
<v speaker_1>So I'd love ...

00:06:44.844 --> 00:06:45.524
<v speaker_1>So I'll tell

00:06:45.524 --> 00:06:46.304
<v speaker_1>you. So like in

00:06:46.304 --> 00:06:48.644
<v speaker_1>'76, '77, and

00:06:48.644 --> 00:06:49.144
<v speaker_1>y'all have it on

00:06:49.144 --> 00:06:50.484
<v speaker_1>your website, the

00:06:50.484 --> 00:06:52.384
<v speaker_1>Caller-Times did this whole

00:06:52.384 --> 00:06:54.183
<v speaker_1>series about

00:06:54.184 --> 00:06:56.424
<v speaker_1>LGBT, right? And

00:06:56.424 --> 00:06:58.504
<v speaker_1>me and

00:06:58.504 --> 00:06:59.844
<v speaker_1>Ed and Paul, we

00:06:59.844 --> 00:07:00.464
<v speaker_1>were just all

00:07:00.464 --> 00:07:01.844
<v speaker_1>over that, reading it.

00:07:01.844 --> 00:07:04.184
<v speaker_1>Uh, so we

00:07:04.184 --> 00:07:05.604
<v speaker_1>read about, I read

00:07:05.604 --> 00:07:06.744
<v speaker_1>about a woman

00:07:06.744 --> 00:07:07.784
<v speaker_1>named Lee Ellif, who

00:07:07.784 --> 00:07:08.544
<v speaker_1>owned the White

00:07:08.544 --> 00:07:10.884
<v speaker_1>Rabbit. And in this

00:07:10.884 --> 00:07:11.823
<v speaker_1>news article, it

00:07:11.824 --> 00:07:13.194
<v speaker_1>talked about, she talked

00:07:13.194 --> 00:07:14.644
<v speaker_1>about how young

00:07:14.644 --> 00:07:15.644
<v speaker_1>people would come into

00:07:15.644 --> 00:07:16.804
<v speaker_1>the bar just

00:07:16.844 --> 00:07:18.844
<v speaker_1>trying to seek some

00:07:18.844 --> 00:07:20.104
<v speaker_1>community or help

00:07:20.104 --> 00:07:22.084
<v speaker_1>or guidance. Um,

00:07:23.224 --> 00:07:24.104
<v speaker_1>it also mentioned the

00:07:24.104 --> 00:07:26.524
<v speaker_1>Jolly Jack. Uh,

00:07:26.524 --> 00:07:27.194
<v speaker_1>so we had our

00:07:27.194 --> 00:07:29.164
<v speaker_1>little driver's licenses.

00:07:29.164 --> 00:07:30.554
<v speaker_1>And, uh, back then,

00:07:30.554 --> 00:07:31.144
<v speaker_1>you know, you

00:07:31.144 --> 00:07:32.554
<v speaker_1>could create fake IDs.

00:07:32.554 --> 00:07:33.044
<v speaker_1>It was pretty

00:07:33.044 --> 00:07:34.884
<v speaker_1>easy. Um, so we

00:07:34.884 --> 00:07:35.354
<v speaker_1>had our little

00:07:35.354 --> 00:07:37.124
<v speaker_1>fake IDs, and off

00:07:37.124 --> 00:07:39.304
<v speaker_1>we went. Um,

00:07:39.304 --> 00:07:40.064
<v speaker_1>and the first bar

00:07:40.064 --> 00:07:40.864
<v speaker_1>we went into

00:07:40.864 --> 00:07:41.904
<v speaker_1>was the Jolly Jack.

00:07:41.904 --> 00:07:41.904
<v speaker_1>

00:07:43.204 --> 00:07:44.104
<v speaker_2>Where was that?

00:07:44.104 --> 00:07:44.944
<v speaker_1>So the Jolly Jack

00:07:44.944 --> 00:07:46.024
<v speaker_1>was downtown Corpus

00:07:46.024 --> 00:07:47.124
<v speaker_1>Christi on People Street.

00:07:47.124 --> 00:07:47.684
<v speaker_1>It's a parking

00:07:47.684 --> 00:07:50.004
<v speaker_1>lot now. Um,

00:07:50.004 --> 00:07:50.864
<v speaker_1>and right next

00:07:50.864 --> 00:07:52.004
<v speaker_1>door to it was

00:07:52.004 --> 00:07:54.084
<v speaker_1>a adult bookstore,

00:07:54.084 --> 00:07:56.244
<v speaker_1>video store. Around the

00:07:56.244 --> 00:07:57.564
<v speaker_1>corner from it,

00:07:57.564 --> 00:07:59.684
<v speaker_1>on Chaparral, was another

00:07:59.684 --> 00:08:01.824
<v speaker_1>bar that,

00:08:01.824 --> 00:08:03.784
<v speaker_1>um, was kind of

00:08:03.784 --> 00:08:04.644
<v speaker_1>a, a gay

00:08:04.644 --> 00:08:05.604
<v speaker_1>bar. It was a

00:08:05.604 --> 00:08:06.904
<v speaker_1>beer bar, beer

00:08:06.904 --> 00:08:08.664
<v speaker_1>license only. It had

00:08:08.664 --> 00:08:09.684
<v speaker_1>really a mixed

00:08:09.684 --> 00:08:11.074
<v speaker_1>crowd in it. It

00:08:11.074 --> 00:08:11.724
<v speaker_1>had some straight

00:08:11.724 --> 00:08:12.684
<v speaker_1>people. It had gay

00:08:12.684 --> 00:08:14.243
<v speaker_1>people. But, you

00:08:14.243 --> 00:08:15.324
<v speaker_1>know, so the Jolly

00:08:15.324 --> 00:08:16.283
<v speaker_1>Jack was mostly

00:08:16.284 --> 00:08:18.164
<v speaker_1>men. Um,

00:08:20.204 --> 00:08:20.664
<v speaker_1>so yeah, so we

00:08:20.664 --> 00:08:21.223
<v speaker_1>go to the

00:08:21.224 --> 00:08:22.424
<v speaker_1>Jolly Jack, and that's

00:08:22.424 --> 00:08:23.184
<v speaker_1>kind of where

00:08:23.184 --> 00:08:25.644
<v speaker_1>we started easing

00:08:25.644 --> 00:08:27.084
<v speaker_1>our way into the

00:08:27.084 --> 00:08:28.964
<v speaker_1>community. And then

00:08:28.964 --> 00:08:29.944
<v speaker_1>the, that was the

00:08:29.944 --> 00:08:31.384
<v speaker_1>community. The bars

00:08:31.384 --> 00:08:32.684
<v speaker_1>were the community. That

00:08:32.684 --> 00:08:34.784
<v speaker_1>was it. So,

00:08:34.784 --> 00:08:36.444
<v speaker_1>um, by the time

00:08:36.444 --> 00:08:37.103
<v speaker_1>I came of

00:08:37.104 --> 00:08:39.354
<v speaker_1>age, 18, the White

00:08:39.354 --> 00:08:41.663
<v speaker_1>Rabbit had closed,

00:08:41.664 --> 00:08:43.144
<v speaker_1>and the disco bar

00:08:43.144 --> 00:08:44.664
<v speaker_1>or big bar

00:08:44.664 --> 00:08:46.444
<v speaker_1>was the Zodiac.

00:08:46.444 --> 00:08:47.704
<v speaker_1>And it was

00:08:47.704 --> 00:08:48.584
<v speaker_1>on Staples. It was

00:08:48.584 --> 00:08:49.984
<v speaker_1>actually just down

00:08:49.984 --> 00:08:51.504
<v speaker_1>the street, kind of

00:08:51.504 --> 00:08:53.364
<v speaker_1>where, um, Del

00:08:53.364 --> 00:08:54.204
<v speaker_1>Mar has taken over

00:08:54.204 --> 00:08:54.864
<v speaker_1>part of that,

00:08:54.864 --> 00:08:55.734
<v speaker_1>kind of Louisiana and

00:08:55.734 --> 00:08:57.924
<v speaker_1>Staples area. So

00:08:57.924 --> 00:08:58.744
<v speaker_1>that's where the Zodiac

00:08:58.744 --> 00:08:59.564
<v speaker_1>was. I think

00:08:59.564 --> 00:09:00.564
<v speaker_1>previously it was called

00:09:00.564 --> 00:09:01.564
<v speaker_1>something else, like

00:09:01.564 --> 00:09:02.584
<v speaker_1>the Quarter Horse. But,

00:09:02.584 --> 00:09:04.844
<v speaker_1>um, so it

00:09:04.844 --> 00:09:05.984
<v speaker_1>was a disco bar,

00:09:05.984 --> 00:09:08.204
<v speaker_1>uh,

00:09:08.244 --> 00:09:09.924
<v speaker_1>loud music and mixed

00:09:09.924 --> 00:09:11.824
<v speaker_1>drinks and, and

00:09:11.824 --> 00:09:13.344
<v speaker_1>that's where everyone went.

00:09:13.344 --> 00:09:14.164
<v speaker_1>

00:09:14.164 --> 00:09:14.764
<v speaker_2>How did you know

00:09:14.764 --> 00:09:16.084
<v speaker_2>that these were,

00:09:16.084 --> 00:09:18.404
<v speaker_2>um, LGBT bars

00:09:18.404 --> 00:09:19.524
<v speaker_2>specifically, like a gay

00:09:19.524 --> 00:09:20.343
<v speaker_2>bar, lesbian bar?

00:09:20.344 --> 00:09:20.964
<v speaker_1>Well, so we learned

00:09:20.964 --> 00:09:21.644
<v speaker_1>about it, like,

00:09:21.644 --> 00:09:22.424
<v speaker_1>by going to the

00:09:22.424 --> 00:09:23.244
<v speaker_1>Jolly Jack, 'cause

00:09:23.244 --> 00:09:24.033
<v speaker_1>we read that in

00:09:24.033 --> 00:09:25.664
<v speaker_1>the newspaper, so

00:09:25.664 --> 00:09:26.404
<v speaker_1>we knew that.

00:09:28.204 --> 00:09:29.044
<v speaker_1>And then we just

00:09:29.044 --> 00:09:30.104
<v speaker_1>talked. And remember

00:09:30.104 --> 00:09:30.904
<v speaker_1>I mentioned this guy,

00:09:30.904 --> 00:09:33.224
<v speaker_1>Chris Barber? So

00:09:33.224 --> 00:09:34.744
<v speaker_1>George had moved.

00:09:34.744 --> 00:09:35.124
<v speaker_1>I don't know what

00:09:35.124 --> 00:09:35.824
<v speaker_1>happened to him.

00:09:35.824 --> 00:09:37.404
<v speaker_1>But Chris Barber stayed

00:09:37.404 --> 00:09:39.044
<v speaker_1>around. And Chris

00:09:39.044 --> 00:09:39.984
<v speaker_1>was a drag queen

00:09:39.984 --> 00:09:40.964
<v speaker_1>too, and Chris

00:09:40.964 --> 00:09:42.644
<v speaker_1>would tell us. He

00:09:42.644 --> 00:09:43.864
<v speaker_1>was much older

00:09:43.864 --> 00:09:45.684
<v speaker_1>than us, like, you

00:09:45.684 --> 00:09:46.464
<v speaker_1>know, but Chris

00:09:46.464 --> 00:09:47.464
<v speaker_1>would tell us things.

00:09:47.464 --> 00:09:49.004
<v speaker_1>Um, he was

00:09:49.004 --> 00:09:51.464
<v speaker_1>witty and, um,

00:09:51.464 --> 00:09:53.843
<v speaker_1>and kind,

00:09:53.844 --> 00:09:54.564
<v speaker_1>and he also had

00:09:54.564 --> 00:09:55.504
<v speaker_1>really good drugs.

00:09:57.524 --> 00:09:58.224
<v speaker_1>I'm just saying it.

00:09:58.224 --> 00:09:59.844
<v speaker_1>I'm just saying

00:09:59.844 --> 00:10:00.244
<v speaker_1>it. It was the

00:10:00.244 --> 00:10:00.984
<v speaker_1>'70s and the

00:10:00.984 --> 00:10:03.384
<v speaker_1>early '80s. [laughs]

00:10:03.384 --> 00:10:04.144
<v speaker_1>There were a

00:10:04.144 --> 00:10:05.003
<v speaker_1>lot of drugs.

00:10:06.444 --> 00:10:08.464
<v speaker_1>[clears throat] So, um,

00:10:09.524 --> 00:10:10.264
<v speaker_1>yeah, so, you know,

00:10:10.264 --> 00:10:11.104
<v speaker_1>we'd hang out

00:10:11.104 --> 00:10:12.664
<v speaker_1>in the Zodiac and,

00:10:12.664 --> 00:10:13.904
<v speaker_1>you know, have

00:10:13.904 --> 00:10:14.984
<v speaker_1>our job during the

00:10:14.984 --> 00:10:16.044
<v speaker_1>dayti- you know,

00:10:16.044 --> 00:10:17.344
<v speaker_1>during the week, and

00:10:17.344 --> 00:10:17.864
<v speaker_1>that's where we

00:10:17.864 --> 00:10:18.524
<v speaker_1>went, is to the

00:10:18.524 --> 00:10:20.564
<v speaker_1>Zodiac. I actually

00:10:20.564 --> 00:10:21.804
<v speaker_1>... The, the

00:10:21.804 --> 00:10:22.904
<v speaker_1>bartender at the Jolly

00:10:22.904 --> 00:10:23.484
<v speaker_1>Jack was a

00:10:23.484 --> 00:10:24.563
<v speaker_1>guy named Buck,

00:10:25.824 --> 00:10:27.784
<v speaker_1>also much older. Uh,

00:10:27.784 --> 00:10:28.704
<v speaker_1>but he taught

00:10:28.704 --> 00:10:29.924
<v speaker_1>me how to bartend.

00:10:29.924 --> 00:10:30.964
<v speaker_1>He would sneak

00:10:30.964 --> 00:10:31.884
<v speaker_1>me into the bar

00:10:31.884 --> 00:10:32.704
<v speaker_1>with him when

00:10:32.704 --> 00:10:34.304
<v speaker_1>it was slow and

00:10:34.304 --> 00:10:34.643
<v speaker_1>taught me how

00:10:34.644 --> 00:10:36.044
<v speaker_1>to bartend. And so

00:10:36.044 --> 00:10:38.144
<v speaker_1>George, and I

00:10:38.144 --> 00:10:38.964
<v speaker_1>believe his last name

00:10:38.964 --> 00:10:41.294
<v speaker_1>was Howard, can't

00:10:41.294 --> 00:10:41.804
<v speaker_1>... But he was,

00:10:41.804 --> 00:10:44.044
<v speaker_1>like, the owner/manager

00:10:44.044 --> 00:10:45.104
<v speaker_1>of the Jack and

00:10:45.104 --> 00:10:46.523
<v speaker_1>the Zodiac and

00:10:46.524 --> 00:10:47.164
<v speaker_1>the other bar around

00:10:47.164 --> 00:10:48.364
<v speaker_1>the corner, which

00:10:48.364 --> 00:10:48.964
<v speaker_1>I can't remember the

00:10:48.964 --> 00:10:50.624
<v speaker_1>name of. Um,

00:10:51.904 --> 00:10:53.884
<v speaker_1>George hired me. I,

00:10:53.884 --> 00:10:54.304
<v speaker_1>I was the

00:10:54.304 --> 00:10:56.324
<v speaker_1>first woman bartender in

00:10:56.324 --> 00:10:58.434
<v speaker_1>the LGBT community,

00:10:58.434 --> 00:10:59.944
<v speaker_1>and I worked, uh,

00:10:59.944 --> 00:11:01.404
<v speaker_1>the back bar

00:11:01.404 --> 00:11:02.214
<v speaker_1>on the busy nights,

00:11:02.214 --> 00:11:03.023
<v speaker_1>Friday and Saturday

00:11:03.024 --> 00:11:04.284
<v speaker_1>nights, and then Sunday

00:11:04.284 --> 00:11:05.084
<v speaker_1>nights I worked

00:11:05.084 --> 00:11:06.854
<v speaker_1>the main bar. Um,

00:11:06.854 --> 00:11:09.204
<v speaker_1>yeah. So that

00:11:09.204 --> 00:11:10.804
<v speaker_1>was fun. Actually, it

00:11:10.804 --> 00:11:12.104
<v speaker_1>wasn't. Um,

00:11:13.924 --> 00:11:14.824
<v speaker_1>I thought by being

00:11:14.824 --> 00:11:15.684
<v speaker_1>the bartender that

00:11:15.684 --> 00:11:16.664
<v speaker_1>I'd get to in-

00:11:16.664 --> 00:11:17.764
<v speaker_1>drink a lot

00:11:17.764 --> 00:11:18.934
<v speaker_1>more. [laughs]

00:11:20.864 --> 00:11:21.624
<v speaker_1>But as it turns

00:11:21.624 --> 00:11:22.584
<v speaker_1>out, you're really

00:11:22.584 --> 00:11:24.584
<v speaker_1>busy bartending, so you

00:11:24.584 --> 00:11:25.024
<v speaker_1>don't really have

00:11:25.024 --> 00:11:26.184
<v speaker_1>time to drink. So

00:11:26.184 --> 00:11:26.704
<v speaker_1>that's kind of

00:11:26.704 --> 00:11:28.224
<v speaker_1>a bummer, but-

00:11:28.224 --> 00:11:28.924
<v speaker_2>A good facet to

00:11:28.924 --> 00:11:29.804
<v speaker_2>know the community

00:11:29.804 --> 00:11:30.464
<v speaker_2>though, right? A good

00:11:30.464 --> 00:11:31.124
<v speaker_2>way to-

00:11:31.124 --> 00:11:31.424
<v speaker_1>Oh, yeah

00:11:31.424 --> 00:11:32.514
<v speaker_2>... engage people and-

00:11:32.514 --> 00:11:32.664
<v speaker_2>

00:11:32.664 --> 00:11:34.504
<v speaker_1>Oh, absolutely. You know,

00:11:34.504 --> 00:11:35.404
<v speaker_1>and just be

00:11:35.404 --> 00:11:35.824
<v speaker_1>part ... Oh, and

00:11:35.824 --> 00:11:36.764
<v speaker_1>the community then,

00:11:37.844 --> 00:11:38.744
<v speaker_1>God, it was so

00:11:38.744 --> 00:11:40.264
<v speaker_1>great. And, you

00:11:40.264 --> 00:11:42.384
<v speaker_1>know, it was prior

00:11:42.384 --> 00:11:43.644
<v speaker_1>to AIDS, right?

00:11:43.644 --> 00:11:44.504
<v speaker_1>So it was the

00:11:44.504 --> 00:11:45.704
<v speaker_1>late '70s, early

00:11:45.704 --> 00:11:48.104
<v speaker_1>'80s. And, um,

00:11:48.104 --> 00:11:48.984
<v speaker_1>uh, all these

00:11:48.984 --> 00:11:51.404
<v speaker_1>beautiful men. Um, there

00:11:51.404 --> 00:11:52.984
<v speaker_1>was a fellow

00:11:52.984 --> 00:11:53.984
<v speaker_1>who's deaf,

00:11:55.024 --> 00:11:56.674
<v speaker_1>and he and his

00:11:56.674 --> 00:11:57.964
<v speaker_1>partner would do

00:11:57.964 --> 00:11:59.604
<v speaker_1>this great disco dancing

00:11:59.604 --> 00:12:00.244
<v speaker_1>just to the

00:12:00.244 --> 00:12:02.264
<v speaker_1>beat, uh, that came

00:12:02.264 --> 00:12:03.564
<v speaker_1>from the sound.

00:12:03.564 --> 00:12:05.784
<v speaker_1>They were fantastic. He,

00:12:05.784 --> 00:12:07.884
<v speaker_1>um, was

00:12:07.884 --> 00:12:10.776
<v speaker_1>murdered-Um,

00:12:10.776 --> 00:12:13.096
<v speaker_1>you know, you

00:12:13.096 --> 00:12:14.396
<v speaker_1>guys, gay men,

00:12:15.816 --> 00:12:16.456
<v speaker_1>uh, spent a lot

00:12:16.456 --> 00:12:16.876
<v speaker_1>of time on

00:12:16.876 --> 00:12:17.886
<v speaker_1>the seawall, and that

00:12:17.886 --> 00:12:18.355
<v speaker_1>was really a

00:12:18.356 --> 00:12:20.556
<v speaker_1>big pickup place. Um,

00:12:20.556 --> 00:12:22.036
<v speaker_1>you know, and

00:12:22.036 --> 00:12:23.016
<v speaker_1>nobody knew what the

00:12:23.016 --> 00:12:23.876
<v speaker_1>hell safe sex

00:12:23.876 --> 00:12:24.616
<v speaker_1>was. I mean, that

00:12:24.616 --> 00:12:25.136
<v speaker_1>was like, what,

00:12:25.136 --> 00:12:25.856
<v speaker_1>is there a safety

00:12:25.856 --> 00:12:26.555
<v speaker_1>net or something?

00:12:26.556 --> 00:12:27.256
<v speaker_1>Like, what is that?

00:12:27.256 --> 00:12:28.216
<v speaker_1>That doesn't even

00:12:28.216 --> 00:12:29.736
<v speaker_1>work. Um,

00:12:30.876 --> 00:12:31.696
<v speaker_1>but he got picked

00:12:31.696 --> 00:12:32.306
<v speaker_1>up by somebody,

00:12:32.306 --> 00:12:33.216
<v speaker_1>and he was murdered.

00:12:33.216 --> 00:12:34.256
<v speaker_1>And, um, man,

00:12:34.256 --> 00:12:35.076
<v speaker_1>he was a beautiful

00:12:35.076 --> 00:12:36.816
<v speaker_1>man. Um,

00:12:38.436 --> 00:12:39.836
<v speaker_1>there was another bartender

00:12:39.836 --> 00:12:40.856
<v speaker_1>who was also

00:12:40.856 --> 00:12:41.476
<v speaker_1>George. A lot of

00:12:41.476 --> 00:12:42.555
<v speaker_1>Georges. I don't

00:12:42.556 --> 00:12:44.216
<v speaker_1>get that. But he

00:12:44.216 --> 00:12:44.936
<v speaker_1>was a beautiful

00:12:44.936 --> 00:12:46.116
<v speaker_1>man, and his partner,

00:12:46.116 --> 00:12:47.656
<v speaker_1>I can't remember

00:12:47.656 --> 00:12:48.416
<v speaker_1>his name, but he

00:12:48.416 --> 00:12:50.116
<v speaker_1>looked like, um,

00:12:51.176 --> 00:12:51.916
<v speaker_1>Oats from Hall &

00:12:51.916 --> 00:12:54.376
<v speaker_1>Oats. And just

00:12:54.376 --> 00:12:56.356
<v speaker_1>beautiful man. Um,

00:12:57.916 --> 00:13:00.216
<v speaker_1>so then ...

00:13:00.216 --> 00:13:00.896
<v speaker_1>Oh, and the

00:13:00.896 --> 00:13:02.036
<v speaker_1>queen. So George Howard,

00:13:02.036 --> 00:13:02.556
<v speaker_1>the guy who

00:13:02.556 --> 00:13:03.576
<v speaker_1>was the manager, owner,

00:13:03.576 --> 00:13:04.396
<v speaker_1>whatever he was,

00:13:05.516 --> 00:13:06.996
<v speaker_1>his partner was a

00:13:06.996 --> 00:13:08.276
<v speaker_1>drag queen called

00:13:08.276 --> 00:13:10.036
<v speaker_1>Michelle Lee.

00:13:12.056 --> 00:13:12.996
<v speaker_1>She was the queen

00:13:12.996 --> 00:13:14.676
<v speaker_1>bee. And they

00:13:14.676 --> 00:13:15.976
<v speaker_1>would do drag shows

00:13:15.976 --> 00:13:18.076
<v speaker_1>at the Zodiac.

00:13:18.076 --> 00:13:19.036
<v speaker_1>Um, and they were

00:13:19.036 --> 00:13:19.936
<v speaker_1>good. I mean,

00:13:19.936 --> 00:13:21.156
<v speaker_1>you know, they were

00:13:21.156 --> 00:13:22.776
<v speaker_1>good. Um,

00:13:24.296 --> 00:13:24.696
<v speaker_1>it was a good

00:13:24.696 --> 00:13:25.636
<v speaker_1>time. It was

00:13:28.056 --> 00:13:28.636
<v speaker_1>... Because of the

00:13:28.636 --> 00:13:30.456
<v speaker_1>late '70s, it

00:13:30.456 --> 00:13:31.346
<v speaker_1>was the late '70s

00:13:31.346 --> 00:13:31.956
<v speaker_1>and the early

00:13:31.956 --> 00:13:32.866
<v speaker_1>'80s, and all the

00:13:32.866 --> 00:13:33.456
<v speaker_1>things that had

00:13:33.456 --> 00:13:34.976
<v speaker_1>happened in the '60s,

00:13:34.976 --> 00:13:37.376
<v speaker_1>right? And Stonewall.

00:13:37.376 --> 00:13:39.456
<v speaker_1>And, you know, we

00:13:39.456 --> 00:13:40.436
<v speaker_1>all felt a

00:13:40.436 --> 00:13:42.716
<v speaker_1>little safer, more

00:13:42.716 --> 00:13:44.576
<v speaker_1>open, more able

00:13:44.576 --> 00:13:46.436
<v speaker_1>to be around each

00:13:46.436 --> 00:13:48.296
<v speaker_1>other in community.

00:13:48.296 --> 00:13:49.176
<v speaker_1>Though it still wasn't

00:13:49.176 --> 00:13:50.296
<v speaker_1>completely safe for

00:13:50.296 --> 00:13:51.276
<v speaker_1>us. Like, the parking

00:13:51.276 --> 00:13:52.876
<v speaker_1>lots, our cars

00:13:52.876 --> 00:13:55.076
<v speaker_1>would get damaged,

00:13:55.076 --> 00:13:56.996
<v speaker_1>vandalized when we, you

00:13:56.996 --> 00:13:57.876
<v speaker_1>know, at the

00:13:57.876 --> 00:13:59.356
<v speaker_1>Zodiac. Um,

00:14:00.396 --> 00:14:00.896
<v speaker_1>you know, a lot

00:14:00.896 --> 00:14:01.676
<v speaker_1>of times we

00:14:01.676 --> 00:14:03.736
<v speaker_1>would, women would, you

00:14:03.736 --> 00:14:06.056
<v speaker_1>know, ask somebody,

00:14:06.056 --> 00:14:07.156
<v speaker_1>a gay man, to

00:14:07.156 --> 00:14:08.035
<v speaker_1>escort them to

00:14:08.036 --> 00:14:09.436
<v speaker_1>their car, help us,

00:14:09.436 --> 00:14:11.246
<v speaker_1>uh, get, you

00:14:11.246 --> 00:14:12.076
<v speaker_1>know, safely into our

00:14:12.076 --> 00:14:13.116
<v speaker_1>vehicles because we

00:14:13.116 --> 00:14:14.916
<v speaker_1>weren't always completely safe.

00:14:14.916 --> 00:14:16.096
<v speaker_1>I mean, we're

00:14:16.096 --> 00:14:17.376
<v speaker_1>not still, but I

00:14:17.376 --> 00:14:17.876
<v speaker_1>mean, it was

00:14:17.876 --> 00:14:19.166
<v speaker_1>much more dangerous then.

00:14:19.166 --> 00:14:20.856
<v speaker_1>Uh, and we

00:14:20.856 --> 00:14:22.036
<v speaker_1>certainly couldn't be out

00:14:22.036 --> 00:14:24.396
<v speaker_1>at our jobs,

00:14:24.396 --> 00:14:26.336
<v speaker_1>um, or, like, in

00:14:26.336 --> 00:14:27.036
<v speaker_1>the world. But

00:14:27.036 --> 00:14:28.176
<v speaker_1>in our community, man,

00:14:28.176 --> 00:14:29.336
<v speaker_1>we were. You

00:14:29.336 --> 00:14:31.496
<v speaker_1>know? Uh, it was

00:14:31.496 --> 00:14:32.316
<v speaker_1>so great, you

00:14:32.316 --> 00:14:33.836
<v speaker_1>know. I, you know,

00:14:33.836 --> 00:14:34.916
<v speaker_1>had no problem

00:14:34.916 --> 00:14:35.796
<v speaker_1>telling people, you know,

00:14:35.796 --> 00:14:37.176
<v speaker_1>"I am butch."

00:14:37.176 --> 00:14:39.296
<v speaker_1>Now, today, you know,

00:14:39.296 --> 00:14:40.496
<v speaker_1>I'm, uh, I,

00:14:40.496 --> 00:14:40.996
<v speaker_1>I feel like I'm

00:14:40.996 --> 00:14:41.836
<v speaker_1>a dying breed.

00:14:41.836 --> 00:14:43.536
<v speaker_1>I'm an endangered species.

00:14:43.536 --> 00:14:44.676
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:14:45.996 --> 00:14:46.696
<v speaker_1>'cause there really aren't

00:14:46.696 --> 00:14:47.655
<v speaker_1>that many women

00:14:47.656 --> 00:14:48.796
<v speaker_1>that just identify as

00:14:48.796 --> 00:14:50.536
<v speaker_1>butch dykes anymore.

00:14:50.536 --> 00:14:51.676
<v speaker_1>You know, they identify

00:14:51.676 --> 00:14:52.636
<v speaker_1>as something else.

00:14:52.636 --> 00:14:53.356
<v speaker_1>And it's all very

00:14:53.356 --> 00:14:55.136
<v speaker_1>confusing to me,

00:14:55.136 --> 00:14:56.676
<v speaker_1>the whole alphabet. But

00:14:56.676 --> 00:14:58.056
<v speaker_1>I'm trying very

00:14:58.056 --> 00:14:58.446
<v speaker_1>hard.

00:14:58.446 --> 00:14:59.026
<v speaker_3>So running a little

00:14:59.026 --> 00:15:00.436
<v speaker_3>personal on it

00:15:00.436 --> 00:15:01.116
<v speaker_3>is when did you

00:15:01.116 --> 00:15:01.576
<v speaker_3>get your first

00:15:01.576 --> 00:15:02.236
<v speaker_3>motorcycle?

00:15:03.796 --> 00:15:04.356
<v speaker_1>I got my first

00:15:04.356 --> 00:15:05.376
<v speaker_1>motorcycle when I

00:15:05.376 --> 00:15:06.176
<v speaker_1>got sober.

00:15:07.616 --> 00:15:07.956
<v speaker_3>Smart.

00:15:09.036 --> 00:15:11.196
<v speaker_1>Yeah. Well, I, you

00:15:11.196 --> 00:15:11.556
<v speaker_1>know, when I

00:15:11.556 --> 00:15:12.026
<v speaker_1>got ... So I

00:15:12.026 --> 00:15:12.756
<v speaker_1>got sober in

00:15:12.756 --> 00:15:13.745
<v speaker_1>1985.

00:15:16.436 --> 00:15:17.636
<v speaker_1>And I left Corpus

00:15:17.636 --> 00:15:18.576
<v speaker_1>Christi at that

00:15:18.576 --> 00:15:20.166
<v speaker_1>time then. That's when

00:15:20.166 --> 00:15:20.896
<v speaker_1>I left. And

00:15:20.896 --> 00:15:21.816
<v speaker_1>my parents were very

00:15:21.816 --> 00:15:22.816
<v speaker_1>wise, and I'm

00:15:22.816 --> 00:15:24.576
<v speaker_1>so grateful. Uh,

00:15:25.685 --> 00:15:26.896
<v speaker_1>I, I went into

00:15:26.896 --> 00:15:28.176
<v speaker_1>Six West at

00:15:28.176 --> 00:15:30.126
<v speaker_1>Memorial Hospital. And, uh,

00:15:30.126 --> 00:15:30.826
<v speaker_1>my, the f-

00:15:30.826 --> 00:15:31.836
<v speaker_1>my first real true

00:15:31.836 --> 00:15:32.556
<v speaker_1>love, the woman

00:15:32.556 --> 00:15:34.656
<v speaker_1>who broke my heart,

00:15:34.656 --> 00:15:36.636
<v speaker_1>and I'm still

00:15:36.636 --> 00:15:37.796
<v speaker_1>not completely over it.

00:15:37.796 --> 00:15:39.276
<v speaker_1>I'm just telling

00:15:39.276 --> 00:15:41.156
<v speaker_1>you. She was a

00:15:41.156 --> 00:15:41.876
<v speaker_1>psych nurse.

00:15:43.736 --> 00:15:44.456
<v speaker_1>And of course, we'd

00:15:44.456 --> 00:15:45.356
<v speaker_1>split up, and

00:15:45.356 --> 00:15:45.996
<v speaker_1>she'd moved to San

00:15:45.996 --> 00:15:46.776
<v speaker_1>Antonio. But she'd

00:15:46.776 --> 00:15:47.206
<v speaker_1>come down for the

00:15:47.206 --> 00:15:48.536
<v speaker_1>weekend, and we'd

00:15:48.536 --> 00:15:49.316
<v speaker_1>hung out for a

00:15:49.316 --> 00:15:49.965
<v speaker_1>w- you know,

00:15:49.965 --> 00:15:51.736
<v speaker_1>over the weekend. And

00:15:51.736 --> 00:15:52.256
<v speaker_1>she came to

00:15:52.256 --> 00:15:52.736
<v speaker_1>pick me up for

00:15:52.736 --> 00:15:53.656
<v speaker_1>breakfast on a

00:15:53.656 --> 00:15:56.096
<v speaker_1>Sunday. And,

00:15:56.096 --> 00:15:56.576
<v speaker_1>uh, I got

00:15:56.576 --> 00:15:57.056
<v speaker_1>in the car with

00:15:57.056 --> 00:15:57.976
<v speaker_1>her, and she

00:15:57.976 --> 00:15:58.596
<v speaker_1>drove me to Six

00:15:58.596 --> 00:15:59.616
<v speaker_1>West, to Memorial

00:15:59.616 --> 00:16:00.236
<v speaker_1>Hospital. And I said,

00:16:00.236 --> 00:16:00.576
<v speaker_1>"What the hell

00:16:00.576 --> 00:16:01.216
<v speaker_1>are we doing here?"

00:16:01.216 --> 00:16:02.636
<v speaker_1>She said, "I

00:16:02.636 --> 00:16:03.496
<v speaker_1>want you to voluntarily

00:16:03.496 --> 00:16:04.656
<v speaker_1>commit yourself." I

00:16:04.656 --> 00:16:06.696
<v speaker_1>said, and I said,

00:16:06.696 --> 00:16:06.696
<v speaker_1>

00:16:08.566 --> 00:16:10.676
<v speaker_1>"Great. I'm crazy.

00:16:10.676 --> 00:16:12.256
<v speaker_1>That's the problem."

00:16:14.176 --> 00:16:15.656
<v speaker_1>[laughs] And I did

00:16:15.656 --> 00:16:17.076
<v speaker_1>that. And then

00:16:17.076 --> 00:16:18.176
<v speaker_1>I went into DTs.

00:16:18.176 --> 00:16:20.636
<v speaker_1>Um, then, and

00:16:20.636 --> 00:16:22.236
<v speaker_1>again, I'm just so

00:16:22.236 --> 00:16:23.436
<v speaker_1>fortunate in my

00:16:23.436 --> 00:16:24.556
<v speaker_1>world, in my life,

00:16:24.556 --> 00:16:26.096
<v speaker_1>that my parents

00:16:26.096 --> 00:16:27.725
<v speaker_1>came to me and,

00:16:27.725 --> 00:16:28.916
<v speaker_1>you know, they

00:16:28.916 --> 00:16:29.796
<v speaker_1>told me about these

00:16:29.796 --> 00:16:31.055
<v speaker_1>treatment centers. I

00:16:31.056 --> 00:16:31.516
<v speaker_1>mean, there were, like,

00:16:31.516 --> 00:16:32.676
<v speaker_1>six in Corpus

00:16:32.676 --> 00:16:34.716
<v speaker_1>Christi. But my parent,

00:16:34.716 --> 00:16:35.926
<v speaker_1>my mother's like,

00:16:35.926 --> 00:16:36.726
<v speaker_1>"Well, you know," and

00:16:36.726 --> 00:16:37.556
<v speaker_1>she's, like, a

00:16:37.556 --> 00:16:39.556
<v speaker_1>Southern woman. She's like

00:16:39.556 --> 00:16:40.776
<v speaker_1>a Southern Jacqueline

00:16:40.776 --> 00:16:41.976
<v speaker_1>Onassis. I kid you

00:16:41.976 --> 00:16:43.376
<v speaker_1>not. I mean,

00:16:43.376 --> 00:16:44.196
<v speaker_1>she real- Would you

00:16:44.196 --> 00:16:45.436
<v speaker_1>not agree?

00:16:45.436 --> 00:16:46.306
<v speaker_4>Sure.

00:16:46.306 --> 00:16:48.536
<v speaker_1>[laughs] Like a Southern

00:16:48.536 --> 00:16:50.516
<v speaker_1>Jackie O. Um,

00:16:50.516 --> 00:16:51.536
<v speaker_1>so she's like, "Well,

00:16:51.536 --> 00:16:52.816
<v speaker_1>you know, they

00:16:52.816 --> 00:16:54.216
<v speaker_1>have these treatment centers,

00:16:54.216 --> 00:16:54.856
<v speaker_1>and there's one

00:16:54.856 --> 00:16:57.146
<v speaker_1>in Dallas. And that's

00:16:57.146 --> 00:16:58.016
<v speaker_1>where Carol Annette's

00:16:58.016 --> 00:17:00.486
<v speaker_1>daughter went." She said,

00:17:00.486 --> 00:17:01.436
<v speaker_1>"But there's also

00:17:01.436 --> 00:17:02.516
<v speaker_1>one in Port Arthur,

00:17:02.516 --> 00:17:03.996
<v speaker_1>and that's just

00:17:03.996 --> 00:17:04.776
<v speaker_1>right there next to

00:17:04.776 --> 00:17:05.556
<v speaker_1>Beaumont where your

00:17:05.556 --> 00:17:06.776
<v speaker_1>sister lives, and so

00:17:06.776 --> 00:17:07.496
<v speaker_1>she could come

00:17:07.496 --> 00:17:09.936
<v speaker_1>visit you."

00:17:09.936 --> 00:17:11.676
<v speaker_1>Didn't even mention the

00:17:11.676 --> 00:17:12.436
<v speaker_1>six in Corpus

00:17:12.436 --> 00:17:14.596
<v speaker_1>Christi. So

00:17:14.596 --> 00:17:15.076
<v speaker_1>smart.

00:17:16.656 --> 00:17:17.596
<v speaker_3>So before we jump

00:17:17.596 --> 00:17:18.516
<v speaker_3>ahead too much-

00:17:18.516 --> 00:17:18.666
<v speaker_1>Yeah

00:17:18.666 --> 00:17:18.786
<v speaker_3>... since we're at

00:17:18.786 --> 00:17:20.156
<v speaker_3>1985 at that

00:17:20.156 --> 00:17:20.966
<v speaker_3>point-

00:17:20.966 --> 00:17:21.816
<v speaker_1>Yeah. And I'm, that's

00:17:21.816 --> 00:17:23.136
<v speaker_1>my Corpus history.

00:17:23.136 --> 00:17:23.836
<v speaker_1>Uh, fr- I mean,

00:17:23.836 --> 00:17:24.896
<v speaker_1>it really stretches

00:17:24.896 --> 00:17:26.456
<v speaker_1>from, like, '77 to

00:17:26.456 --> 00:17:27.896
<v speaker_1>'85.

00:17:27.896 --> 00:17:29.136
<v speaker_3>So that's sort of

00:17:29.136 --> 00:17:29.896
<v speaker_3>getting into a

00:17:29.896 --> 00:17:30.376
<v speaker_3>little bit of the

00:17:30.376 --> 00:17:31.236
<v speaker_3>HIV-

00:17:31.236 --> 00:17:31.316
<v speaker_1>Yeah

00:17:31.316 --> 00:17:32.216
<v speaker_3>... and AIDS crisis.

00:17:32.216 --> 00:17:32.476
<v speaker_3>

00:17:32.476 --> 00:17:32.776
<v speaker_1>Yeah.

00:17:32.776 --> 00:17:34.056
<v speaker_3>So what was your

00:17:34.056 --> 00:17:35.676
<v speaker_3>purview and experience

00:17:35.676 --> 00:17:36.416
<v speaker_3>on that, kind of

00:17:36.416 --> 00:17:37.656
<v speaker_3>observing that occur?

00:17:37.656 --> 00:17:38.126
<v speaker_1>Oh, yeah. So it

00:17:38.126 --> 00:17:39.436
<v speaker_1>was terrible. So,

00:17:39.436 --> 00:17:41.656
<v speaker_1>you know, we lost

00:17:41.656 --> 00:17:43.616
<v speaker_1>an entire generation

00:17:43.616 --> 00:17:45.236
<v speaker_1>of men. And they

00:17:45.236 --> 00:17:47.216
<v speaker_1>were beautiful men,

00:17:47.216 --> 00:17:48.376
<v speaker_1>and they were kind,

00:17:48.376 --> 00:17:49.716
<v speaker_1>and they had

00:17:49.716 --> 00:17:50.876
<v speaker_1>so much to offer.

00:17:50.876 --> 00:17:53.336
<v speaker_1>And,

00:17:53.336 --> 00:17:54.736
<v speaker_1>you know, no one

00:17:54.736 --> 00:17:55.176
<v speaker_1>... You know,

00:17:55.176 --> 00:17:55.816
<v speaker_1>it's just a gay

00:17:55.816 --> 00:17:56.516
<v speaker_1>thing, so we

00:17:56.516 --> 00:17:57.596
<v speaker_1>were nothing. We weren't

00:17:57.596 --> 00:17:59.416
<v speaker_1>even really people.

00:17:59.416 --> 00:18:00.756
<v speaker_1>So no one

00:18:00.756 --> 00:18:02.616
<v speaker_1>cared. You know, by

00:18:02.616 --> 00:18:03.396
<v speaker_1>this point, when

00:18:03.396 --> 00:18:04.336
<v speaker_1>it became a real

00:18:04.336 --> 00:18:06.236
<v speaker_1>crisis, uh, like

00:18:06.236 --> 00:18:07.376
<v speaker_1>in the later '80s,

00:18:07.376 --> 00:18:07.916
<v speaker_1>I was in

00:18:07.916 --> 00:18:09.116
<v speaker_1>New York City, and

00:18:09.116 --> 00:18:09.916
<v speaker_1>I was working

00:18:09.916 --> 00:18:11.776
<v speaker_1>with ACT UP. And

00:18:11.776 --> 00:18:12.436
<v speaker_1>of course, all

00:18:12.436 --> 00:18:13.596
<v speaker_1>the lesbians showed up,

00:18:13.596 --> 00:18:14.696
<v speaker_1>right? To help

00:18:14.696 --> 00:18:15.516
<v speaker_1>these men, 'cause we

00:18:15.516 --> 00:18:16.116
<v speaker_1>were the only

00:18:16.116 --> 00:18:18.268
<v speaker_1>ones.Um,

00:18:19.408 --> 00:18:20.108
<v speaker_1>and you know, a

00:18:20.108 --> 00:18:21.387
<v speaker_1>lot of women,

00:18:21.388 --> 00:18:21.988
<v speaker_1>of course, were in

00:18:21.988 --> 00:18:23.548
<v speaker_1>the health business.

00:18:23.548 --> 00:18:24.548
<v speaker_1>I was not. I

00:18:24.548 --> 00:18:25.228
<v speaker_1>was just busy

00:18:25.228 --> 00:18:27.188
<v speaker_1>being fabulous. But, um,

00:18:27.188 --> 00:18:27.188
<v speaker_1>

00:18:30.588 --> 00:18:32.868
<v speaker_1>yeah, it, um, it

00:18:32.868 --> 00:18:34.328
<v speaker_1>was traumatic. And

00:18:35.508 --> 00:18:37.248
<v speaker_1>these men here in

00:18:37.248 --> 00:18:39.448
<v speaker_1>Corpus Christi, so

00:18:39.448 --> 00:18:40.868
<v speaker_1>many of them we

00:18:40.868 --> 00:18:41.888
<v speaker_1>lost that were

00:18:41.888 --> 00:18:42.648
<v speaker_1>so beautiful. There was

00:18:42.648 --> 00:18:43.248
<v speaker_1>a guy, his

00:18:43.248 --> 00:18:45.058
<v speaker_1>name was Mario. Every

00:18:45.058 --> 00:18:45.748
<v speaker_1>time I would

00:18:45.748 --> 00:18:47.048
<v speaker_1>see him, he would

00:18:47.048 --> 00:18:48.908
<v speaker_1>go, "Hi,

00:18:48.908 --> 00:18:50.588
<v speaker_1>Donna," really loud in

00:18:50.588 --> 00:18:51.908
<v speaker_1>the bar. And

00:18:51.908 --> 00:18:53.608
<v speaker_1>I would go, "Hi,

00:18:53.608 --> 00:18:55.228
<v speaker_1>Mario." He was

00:18:55.228 --> 00:18:55.808
<v speaker_1>just, and he was

00:18:55.808 --> 00:18:58.288
<v speaker_1>gorgeous. You know,

00:18:58.288 --> 00:18:59.108
<v speaker_1>and we lost him.

00:18:59.108 --> 00:19:00.867
<v speaker_1>Um, a fellow

00:19:00.868 --> 00:19:01.408
<v speaker_1>I went to high

00:19:01.408 --> 00:19:02.888
<v speaker_1>school with, Jimmy

00:19:02.888 --> 00:19:03.508
<v speaker_1>Resendiz,

00:19:05.848 --> 00:19:06.768
<v speaker_1>beautiful man.

00:19:07.868 --> 00:19:08.748
<v speaker_1>And, uh,

00:19:10.788 --> 00:19:11.388
<v speaker_1>you know, we lost

00:19:11.388 --> 00:19:12.648
<v speaker_1>him to AIDS.

00:19:12.648 --> 00:19:13.358
<v speaker_1>There's so many of

00:19:13.358 --> 00:19:15.448
<v speaker_1>you. It-- But

00:19:15.448 --> 00:19:17.308
<v speaker_1>it was so frustrating

00:19:17.308 --> 00:19:18.748
<v speaker_1>because no one

00:19:18.748 --> 00:19:19.888
<v speaker_1>wanted to pay attention.

00:19:19.888 --> 00:19:21.907
<v speaker_1>No one wanted

00:19:21.907 --> 00:19:22.478
<v speaker_1>it to be a

00:19:22.478 --> 00:19:23.828
<v speaker_1>thing. But then,

00:19:23.828 --> 00:19:24.888
<v speaker_1>oh, a straight man

00:19:24.888 --> 00:19:25.688
<v speaker_1>gets it. Now

00:19:25.688 --> 00:19:26.508
<v speaker_1>it's something. Not when

00:19:26.508 --> 00:19:27.188
<v speaker_1>a woman gets

00:19:27.188 --> 00:19:28.398
<v speaker_1>it. No, because when,

00:19:28.398 --> 00:19:29.708
<v speaker_1>we, we're like

00:19:29.708 --> 00:19:30.928
<v speaker_1>really the lowest in

00:19:30.928 --> 00:19:31.728
<v speaker_1>the hierarchy of

00:19:31.728 --> 00:19:34.108
<v speaker_1>life. Um,

00:19:34.108 --> 00:19:34.828
<v speaker_1>but, you know, a

00:19:34.828 --> 00:19:35.688
<v speaker_1>straight white man

00:19:35.688 --> 00:19:36.888
<v speaker_1>gets it. Now it's

00:19:36.888 --> 00:19:37.688
<v speaker_1>a problem, you

00:19:37.688 --> 00:19:38.668
<v speaker_1>know. And thank God

00:19:38.668 --> 00:19:39.558
<v speaker_1>for Rock Hudson,

00:19:39.558 --> 00:19:41.168
<v speaker_1>too, you know, coming

00:19:41.168 --> 00:19:42.708
<v speaker_1>out, uh, and

00:19:42.708 --> 00:19:43.988
<v speaker_1>admitting that he had

00:19:43.988 --> 00:19:45.388
<v speaker_1>HIV. So then

00:19:45.388 --> 00:19:46.908
<v speaker_1>it changes. So, you

00:19:46.908 --> 00:19:47.528
<v speaker_1>know, because that

00:19:47.528 --> 00:19:49.208
<v speaker_1>was Nancy Reagan's friend.

00:19:49.208 --> 00:19:50.868
<v speaker_1>Uh, but, you

00:19:50.868 --> 00:19:52.568
<v speaker_1>know, Reagan never would

00:19:52.568 --> 00:19:53.528
<v speaker_1>mention it, talk

00:19:53.528 --> 00:19:55.508
<v speaker_1>about it. Um.

00:19:55.508 --> 00:19:56.188
<v speaker_2>Kind of thinking a

00:19:56.188 --> 00:19:56.908
<v speaker_2>bit about from

00:19:56.908 --> 00:19:59.368
<v speaker_2>1980 to 1990, how

00:19:59.368 --> 00:20:00.008
<v speaker_2>would you sort

00:20:00.008 --> 00:20:01.788
<v speaker_2>of timeline how things

00:20:01.788 --> 00:20:03.568
<v speaker_2>became rapidly a

00:20:03.568 --> 00:20:04.908
<v speaker_2>problem and then where

00:20:04.908 --> 00:20:06.188
<v speaker_2>lots of people

00:20:06.188 --> 00:20:07.068
<v speaker_2>were dying to then

00:20:07.068 --> 00:20:07.628
<v speaker_2>the point that

00:20:07.628 --> 00:20:09.388
<v speaker_2>the government responded?

00:20:09.448 --> 00:20:09.988
<v speaker_1>Well, it was just

00:20:09.988 --> 00:20:11.148
<v speaker_1>a terrible time.

00:20:11.148 --> 00:20:11.908
<v speaker_1>I mean, just people

00:20:11.908 --> 00:20:12.848
<v speaker_1>were dying and

00:20:12.848 --> 00:20:14.348
<v speaker_1>people, our friends, and

00:20:14.348 --> 00:20:15.788
<v speaker_1>again, all of

00:20:15.788 --> 00:20:17.988
<v speaker_1>these beautiful men.

00:20:17.988 --> 00:20:19.028
<v speaker_1>I mean, really,

00:20:19.028 --> 00:20:19.508
<v speaker_1>I mean, we just

00:20:19.508 --> 00:20:20.188
<v speaker_1>lost a fucking

00:20:20.188 --> 00:20:22.628
<v speaker_1>generation of men. And,

00:20:22.628 --> 00:20:23.168
<v speaker_1>you know, we

00:20:23.168 --> 00:20:25.068
<v speaker_1>shouldn't have. You know,

00:20:25.068 --> 00:20:27.468
<v speaker_1>the, we

00:20:27.468 --> 00:20:28.367
<v speaker_1>should have, you know,

00:20:28.367 --> 00:20:29.747
<v speaker_1>they, they, the

00:20:29.748 --> 00:20:31.988
<v speaker_1>government, uh, the

00:20:31.988 --> 00:20:34.468
<v speaker_1>National Health Institute, you

00:20:34.468 --> 00:20:35.148
<v speaker_1>know, really should

00:20:35.148 --> 00:20:36.298
<v speaker_1>have been researching this

00:20:36.298 --> 00:20:37.788
<v speaker_1>and finding a,

00:20:37.788 --> 00:20:38.548
<v speaker_1>a, a cure, finding

00:20:38.548 --> 00:20:39.898
<v speaker_1>some solutions, finding

00:20:39.898 --> 00:20:41.088
<v speaker_1>things to, to do.

00:20:41.088 --> 00:20:43.028
<v speaker_1>We, as a

00:20:43.028 --> 00:20:45.318
<v speaker_1>community, though, we rallied,

00:20:45.318 --> 00:20:47.668
<v speaker_1>right? We rallied

00:20:47.668 --> 00:20:48.448
<v speaker_1>with one another. When

00:20:48.448 --> 00:20:49.608
<v speaker_1>we figured out

00:20:49.608 --> 00:20:50.488
<v speaker_1>that it was sexually

00:20:50.488 --> 00:20:52.668
<v speaker_1>transmitted, um,

00:20:53.728 --> 00:20:54.208
<v speaker_1>you know, then we

00:20:54.208 --> 00:20:55.128
<v speaker_1>just started throwing

00:20:55.128 --> 00:20:56.328
<v speaker_1>out condoms to everyone,

00:20:56.328 --> 00:20:56.928
<v speaker_1>right? You just

00:20:56.928 --> 00:20:57.968
<v speaker_1>couldn't go someplace. Oh,

00:20:57.968 --> 00:20:59.248
<v speaker_1>you're, here, take

00:20:59.248 --> 00:21:00.248
<v speaker_1>a condom. You know,

00:21:00.248 --> 00:21:01.108
<v speaker_1>even the lesbians

00:21:01.108 --> 00:21:02.488
<v speaker_1>were being handed condoms,

00:21:02.488 --> 00:21:03.388
<v speaker_1>you know, because

00:21:03.388 --> 00:21:04.088
<v speaker_1>they hadn't really figured

00:21:04.088 --> 00:21:04.928
<v speaker_1>out dental dams

00:21:04.928 --> 00:21:05.808
<v speaker_1>yet. But then they

00:21:05.808 --> 00:21:06.468
<v speaker_1>figured those out,

00:21:06.468 --> 00:21:06.978
<v speaker_1>and they're like, "Eh,

00:21:06.978 --> 00:21:07.568
<v speaker_1>take some dental

00:21:07.568 --> 00:21:08.748
<v speaker_1>dams." Um,

00:21:10.028 --> 00:21:10.528
<v speaker_1>and so we all

00:21:10.528 --> 00:21:11.048
<v speaker_1>had to start

00:21:11.048 --> 00:21:13.108
<v speaker_1>practicing safe sex, and

00:21:13.108 --> 00:21:14.648
<v speaker_1>we all started

00:21:14.648 --> 00:21:16.128
<v speaker_1>getting tested for HIV,

00:21:16.128 --> 00:21:17.488
<v speaker_1>uh, on a

00:21:17.488 --> 00:21:19.168
<v speaker_1>pretty regular basis, especially

00:21:19.168 --> 00:21:19.728
<v speaker_1>if we were,

00:21:19.728 --> 00:21:20.008
<v speaker_1>you know,

00:21:22.408 --> 00:21:24.068
<v speaker_1>slutting around like some

00:21:24.068 --> 00:21:24.888
<v speaker_1>of us may

00:21:24.888 --> 00:21:26.818
<v speaker_1>have. Not pointing fingers,

00:21:26.818 --> 00:21:29.308
<v speaker_1>but yes, um,

00:21:29.308 --> 00:21:30.108
<v speaker_1>because I'm a slut.

00:21:30.108 --> 00:21:31.088
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:21:34.008 --> 00:21:35.568
<v speaker_1>so that period,

00:21:36.608 --> 00:21:37.828
<v speaker_1>we all tried really

00:21:37.828 --> 00:21:39.008
<v speaker_1>hard, and we

00:21:39.008 --> 00:21:40.818
<v speaker_1>tried politically to get

00:21:40.818 --> 00:21:42.448
<v speaker_1>people's attention, we,

00:21:42.448 --> 00:21:43.298
<v speaker_1>you know, to get

00:21:43.298 --> 00:21:44.408
<v speaker_1>the churches, you

00:21:44.408 --> 00:21:45.568
<v speaker_1>know. The ACT UP

00:21:45.568 --> 00:21:46.568
<v speaker_1>staged this big

00:21:46.568 --> 00:21:48.648
<v speaker_1>die-in, uh, at St.

00:21:48.648 --> 00:21:50.768
<v speaker_1>Patrick's, uh, in

00:21:50.768 --> 00:21:52.728
<v speaker_1>New York. Um,

00:21:53.828 --> 00:21:54.268
<v speaker_1>I, uh...

00:21:57.128 --> 00:21:57.948
<v speaker_1>It is very sad

00:21:57.948 --> 00:21:58.908
<v speaker_1>to watch someone

00:21:58.948 --> 00:22:01.148
<v speaker_1>wither away, just...

00:22:02.448 --> 00:22:03.437
<v speaker_1>And I hope that

00:22:03.437 --> 00:22:04.048
<v speaker_1>none of you

00:22:04.048 --> 00:22:05.068
<v speaker_1>ever have to do

00:22:05.068 --> 00:22:06.528
<v speaker_1>that or witness

00:22:06.528 --> 00:22:08.908
<v speaker_1>that. So,

00:22:08.908 --> 00:22:10.388
<v speaker_1>but then, you

00:22:10.388 --> 00:22:12.168
<v speaker_1>know, research started happening

00:22:12.168 --> 00:22:12.968
<v speaker_1>too, right? So

00:22:12.968 --> 00:22:13.888
<v speaker_1>we were, we were

00:22:13.888 --> 00:22:14.508
<v speaker_1>all handing out

00:22:14.508 --> 00:22:15.408
<v speaker_1>condoms. We're all doing

00:22:15.408 --> 00:22:16.008
<v speaker_1>our stuff, and

00:22:16.008 --> 00:22:17.568
<v speaker_1>the research started happening.

00:22:17.568 --> 00:22:18.508
<v speaker_1>And the, you

00:22:18.508 --> 00:22:19.948
<v speaker_1>know, drugs were being

00:22:19.948 --> 00:22:21.648
<v speaker_1>made available, but

00:22:21.648 --> 00:22:22.448
<v speaker_1>if you were poor,

00:22:22.448 --> 00:22:23.328
<v speaker_1>you really couldn't

00:22:23.328 --> 00:22:24.388
<v speaker_1>get access to that

00:22:24.388 --> 00:22:26.148
<v speaker_1>either, you know?

00:22:26.148 --> 00:22:27.768
<v speaker_1>So again, you know,

00:22:27.768 --> 00:22:28.988
<v speaker_1>not me, I

00:22:28.988 --> 00:22:29.848
<v speaker_1>didn't do this, but

00:22:29.848 --> 00:22:30.628
<v speaker_1>the nurses,

00:22:32.588 --> 00:22:34.067
<v speaker_1>um, you know, they

00:22:34.067 --> 00:22:35.528
<v speaker_1>were, uh, uh,

00:22:35.528 --> 00:22:37.028
<v speaker_1>taking drugs, getting drugs

00:22:37.028 --> 00:22:37.627
<v speaker_1>from the rich

00:22:37.627 --> 00:22:39.448
<v speaker_1>b- men and handing

00:22:39.448 --> 00:22:40.068
<v speaker_1>those out to

00:22:40.068 --> 00:22:41.808
<v speaker_1>the poor people. Um,

00:22:41.808 --> 00:22:44.147
<v speaker_1>I was

00:22:44.148 --> 00:22:45.388
<v speaker_1>involved in a, in

00:22:45.388 --> 00:22:46.588
<v speaker_1>a project called

00:22:46.588 --> 00:22:49.028
<v speaker_1>the CHIA Project. C-H-I-A,

00:22:49.028 --> 00:22:51.128
<v speaker_1>like L'Chaim. The

00:22:51.128 --> 00:22:53.278
<v speaker_1>CHIA Project, uh, which

00:22:53.278 --> 00:22:53.908
<v speaker_1>was a needle

00:22:53.908 --> 00:22:55.208
<v speaker_1>exchange program,

00:22:56.308 --> 00:22:57.428
<v speaker_1>um, to re- you

00:22:57.428 --> 00:22:58.568
<v speaker_1>know, working not

00:22:58.568 --> 00:22:59.608
<v speaker_1>within the gay, just

00:22:59.608 --> 00:23:00.568
<v speaker_1>the gay community,

00:23:00.568 --> 00:23:02.068
<v speaker_1>but for the addicts

00:23:02.068 --> 00:23:03.568
<v speaker_1>too. And, and,

00:23:03.568 --> 00:23:04.288
<v speaker_1>you know, and I

00:23:04.288 --> 00:23:05.328
<v speaker_1>gotta tell you,

00:23:05.328 --> 00:23:06.908
<v speaker_1>prior to this, prior

00:23:06.908 --> 00:23:07.408
<v speaker_1>to me getting

00:23:07.408 --> 00:23:09.608
<v speaker_1>sober, it is amazing

00:23:09.608 --> 00:23:10.208
<v speaker_1>that I am

00:23:10.208 --> 00:23:12.698
<v speaker_1>alive. Because, you

00:23:12.698 --> 00:23:13.808
<v speaker_1>know, I was,

00:23:13.808 --> 00:23:14.408
<v speaker_1>you know, in the

00:23:14.408 --> 00:23:15.368
<v speaker_1>early '80s, that

00:23:15.368 --> 00:23:16.928
<v speaker_1>cocaine was blowing.

00:23:18.288 --> 00:23:19.228
<v speaker_1>And not all of

00:23:19.228 --> 00:23:20.207
<v speaker_1>us were snorting

00:23:20.208 --> 00:23:21.688
<v speaker_1>it. Some of us

00:23:21.688 --> 00:23:22.528
<v speaker_1>were shooting it

00:23:22.528 --> 00:23:24.828
<v speaker_1>up. And, you know,

00:23:24.828 --> 00:23:25.968
<v speaker_1>we certainly were

00:23:25.968 --> 00:23:27.548
<v speaker_1>sharing needles. At least

00:23:27.548 --> 00:23:29.088
<v speaker_1>I was. Um,

00:23:30.328 --> 00:23:30.788
<v speaker_1>you know, it is

00:23:30.788 --> 00:23:32.248
<v speaker_1>really just an

00:23:32.248 --> 00:23:33.428
<v speaker_1>amazing thing that I'm

00:23:33.428 --> 00:23:35.248
<v speaker_1>here, uh, and

00:23:35.248 --> 00:23:37.268
<v speaker_1>not HIV positive. But

00:23:37.268 --> 00:23:38.848
<v speaker_1>the m- men

00:23:38.848 --> 00:23:39.878
<v speaker_1>in my world, you

00:23:39.878 --> 00:23:40.708
<v speaker_1>know, people I

00:23:40.708 --> 00:23:41.408
<v speaker_1>went to high school

00:23:41.408 --> 00:23:42.848
<v speaker_1>with, um,

00:23:43.988 --> 00:23:44.968
<v speaker_1>so many of them

00:23:44.968 --> 00:23:46.168
<v speaker_1>are positive. Well,

00:23:46.168 --> 00:23:47.148
<v speaker_1>one died. One is

00:23:47.148 --> 00:23:48.468
<v speaker_1>still alive,

00:23:48.468 --> 00:23:50.168
<v speaker_1>fortunately. Um,

00:23:50.168 --> 00:23:52.608
<v speaker_1>that was a

00:23:52.608 --> 00:23:54.368
<v speaker_1>nightmare to go through.

00:23:54.368 --> 00:23:55.928
<v speaker_1>And, um,

00:23:57.968 --> 00:23:58.608
<v speaker_1>and I know that

00:23:58.608 --> 00:23:59.728
<v speaker_1>COVID was a

00:23:59.728 --> 00:24:00.728
<v speaker_1>terrible thing for all

00:24:00.728 --> 00:24:01.328
<v speaker_1>of us, and

00:24:01.328 --> 00:24:02.148
<v speaker_1>I'm not trying to

00:24:02.148 --> 00:24:03.728
<v speaker_1>compare this. But,

00:24:03.728 --> 00:24:04.948
<v speaker_1>you know, COVID, it

00:24:04.948 --> 00:24:05.668
<v speaker_1>was just right

00:24:05.668 --> 00:24:06.928
<v speaker_1>out in, in the,

00:24:06.928 --> 00:24:08.128
<v speaker_1>immediately, "Oh, this

00:24:08.128 --> 00:24:08.908
<v speaker_1>is a fucking thing.

00:24:08.908 --> 00:24:09.408
<v speaker_1>You know, it's

00:24:09.408 --> 00:24:10.388
<v speaker_1>a, it's an epidemic,"

00:24:10.388 --> 00:24:11.918
<v speaker_1>right? "Let's hurry

00:24:11.918 --> 00:24:12.668
<v speaker_1>and get stuff done."

00:24:12.668 --> 00:24:14.528
<v speaker_1>But for

00:24:14.528 --> 00:24:16.828
<v speaker_1>the HIV-AIDS crisis,

00:24:16.828 --> 00:24:18.688
<v speaker_1>just years went

00:24:18.688 --> 00:24:19.708
<v speaker_1>by when it was

00:24:19.708 --> 00:24:21.744
<v speaker_1>nothing.You know, and

00:24:21.744 --> 00:24:22.844
<v speaker_1>it was just us

00:24:22.844 --> 00:24:23.944
<v speaker_1>trying to take

00:24:23.944 --> 00:24:24.824
<v speaker_1>care of one another

00:24:24.824 --> 00:24:25.964
<v speaker_1>and trying to

00:24:25.964 --> 00:24:27.064
<v speaker_1>protect one another.

00:24:28.244 --> 00:24:30.284
<v speaker_1>Um, and so we

00:24:30.284 --> 00:24:31.724
<v speaker_1>have to always

00:24:31.724 --> 00:24:33.424
<v speaker_1>remember to not do

00:24:33.424 --> 00:24:34.184
<v speaker_1>that shit. We

00:24:34.184 --> 00:24:34.764
<v speaker_1>have to let our

00:24:34.764 --> 00:24:35.784
<v speaker_1>voices be heard.

00:24:35.784 --> 00:24:36.284
<v speaker_1>We have to be

00:24:36.284 --> 00:24:37.584
<v speaker_1>politically... Anyway, that's

00:24:37.584 --> 00:24:38.194
<v speaker_1>a whole other story.

00:24:38.194 --> 00:24:39.404
<v speaker_1>I'm sorry, Jonathan.

00:24:39.404 --> 00:24:40.834
<v speaker_1>[laughs]

00:24:40.834 --> 00:24:41.924
<v speaker_0>No, I totally agree

00:24:41.924 --> 00:24:42.274
<v speaker_0>with it.

00:24:42.274 --> 00:24:42.274
<v speaker_1>[laughs]

00:24:42.274 --> 00:24:43.444
<v speaker_0>And I think, um,

00:24:43.444 --> 00:24:44.344
<v speaker_0>what year did

00:24:44.344 --> 00:24:45.004
<v speaker_0>you come back to

00:24:45.004 --> 00:24:45.464
<v speaker_0>Corpus?

00:24:47.044 --> 00:24:49.344
<v speaker_1>So I tiptoed

00:24:49.344 --> 00:24:51.244
<v speaker_1>in, uh, I think

00:24:51.244 --> 00:24:52.574
<v speaker_1>in 1987,

00:24:53.824 --> 00:24:54.424
<v speaker_1>briefly.

00:24:56.904 --> 00:24:58.494
<v speaker_1>Um, and I was

00:24:58.494 --> 00:25:00.424
<v speaker_1>sober then, and

00:25:00.424 --> 00:25:01.104
<v speaker_1>so there was still

00:25:01.104 --> 00:25:01.664
<v speaker_1>a, uh, the

00:25:01.664 --> 00:25:03.244
<v speaker_1>gay community was here,

00:25:03.244 --> 00:25:05.134
<v speaker_1>still vibrant. Um,

00:25:07.484 --> 00:25:08.644
<v speaker_1>but there was also,

00:25:08.644 --> 00:25:09.724
<v speaker_1>you know, uh,

00:25:09.724 --> 00:25:11.664
<v speaker_1>LGBT AA meetings, recovery

00:25:11.664 --> 00:25:13.704
<v speaker_1>meetings. Uh, and

00:25:13.704 --> 00:25:14.494
<v speaker_1>there was quite... There

00:25:14.494 --> 00:25:14.964
<v speaker_1>was a pretty

00:25:14.964 --> 00:25:16.664
<v speaker_1>big group of people

00:25:16.664 --> 00:25:18.504
<v speaker_1>'cause again, that

00:25:18.504 --> 00:25:20.424
<v speaker_1>cocaine was flowing much

00:25:20.424 --> 00:25:21.924
<v speaker_1>earlier. Uh,

00:25:23.344 --> 00:25:25.044
<v speaker_1>[coughs] so I, I

00:25:25.044 --> 00:25:26.123
<v speaker_1>tiptoed in. You

00:25:26.123 --> 00:25:27.184
<v speaker_1>know, I was back

00:25:27.184 --> 00:25:28.204
<v speaker_1>maybe... I mean,

00:25:28.204 --> 00:25:29.204
<v speaker_1>not very long, just

00:25:29.204 --> 00:25:30.204
<v speaker_1>maybe a year

00:25:30.204 --> 00:25:32.124
<v speaker_1>or so, um, because

00:25:32.124 --> 00:25:32.464
<v speaker_1>there was a

00:25:32.464 --> 00:25:34.544
<v speaker_1>woman. There always is.

00:25:34.544 --> 00:25:34.704
<v speaker_1>

00:25:34.704 --> 00:25:35.164
<v speaker_0>Mm-hmm.

00:25:35.164 --> 00:25:37.484
<v speaker_1>Uh, then I followed

00:25:37.484 --> 00:25:37.984
<v speaker_1>her to New

00:25:37.984 --> 00:25:40.424
<v speaker_1>York, so. I

00:25:40.424 --> 00:25:41.804
<v speaker_1>moved back to

00:25:41.804 --> 00:25:44.004
<v speaker_1>Texas in

00:25:44.004 --> 00:25:46.144
<v speaker_1>2002?

00:25:46.144 --> 00:25:48.554
<v speaker_1>1. 2001,

00:25:49.704 --> 00:25:50.164
<v speaker_1>uh, is when I

00:25:50.164 --> 00:25:50.824
<v speaker_1>moved back to

00:25:50.824 --> 00:25:52.064
<v speaker_1>Texas, and I've been

00:25:52.064 --> 00:25:53.704
<v speaker_1>here ever since.

00:25:53.704 --> 00:25:54.164
<v speaker_1>But I would come

00:25:54.164 --> 00:25:55.524
<v speaker_1>home to visit

00:25:55.524 --> 00:25:57.104
<v speaker_1>and be around. I

00:25:57.104 --> 00:25:57.664
<v speaker_1>do wanna back

00:25:57.664 --> 00:25:58.164
<v speaker_1>up to The Hidden

00:25:58.164 --> 00:25:58.984
<v speaker_1>Door, though.

00:25:58.984 --> 00:25:59.444
<v speaker_0>Please.

00:26:01.164 --> 00:26:02.084
<v speaker_1>So the door opened

00:26:02.084 --> 00:26:03.964
<v speaker_1>in 1980, and

00:26:03.964 --> 00:26:04.944
<v speaker_1>it was not near

00:26:04.944 --> 00:26:05.744
<v speaker_1>as big as

00:26:05.744 --> 00:26:07.184
<v speaker_1>it is now. It

00:26:07.184 --> 00:26:07.704
<v speaker_1>was just this

00:26:07.704 --> 00:26:09.144
<v speaker_1>little house, and it

00:26:09.144 --> 00:26:10.344
<v speaker_1>was a men's

00:26:10.344 --> 00:26:12.004
<v speaker_1>cruising bar in a

00:26:12.004 --> 00:26:13.484
<v speaker_1>big way. I

00:26:13.484 --> 00:26:14.544
<v speaker_1>mean, you could not

00:26:14.544 --> 00:26:16.364
<v speaker_1>walk through it.

00:26:16.364 --> 00:26:17.704
<v speaker_1>Um, it was so

00:26:17.704 --> 00:26:18.924
<v speaker_1>crowded. There was

00:26:18.924 --> 00:26:20.624
<v speaker_1>also an upstairs area

00:26:20.624 --> 00:26:21.544
<v speaker_1>that was kind

00:26:21.544 --> 00:26:22.824
<v speaker_1>of off limits to,

00:26:22.824 --> 00:26:24.104
<v speaker_1>to... I think,

00:26:25.184 --> 00:26:26.144
<v speaker_1>uh, I'm not entirely

00:26:26.144 --> 00:26:26.624
<v speaker_1>certain what was

00:26:26.624 --> 00:26:28.624
<v speaker_1>happening up there, but

00:26:28.624 --> 00:26:29.064
<v speaker_1>I think there

00:26:29.064 --> 00:26:29.583
<v speaker_1>may have been some

00:26:29.583 --> 00:26:30.544
<v speaker_1>bears involved in

00:26:30.544 --> 00:26:32.153
<v speaker_1>that, and there may

00:26:32.153 --> 00:26:32.584
<v speaker_1>have been some

00:26:32.584 --> 00:26:34.824
<v speaker_1>leather stuff, and possibly

00:26:34.824 --> 00:26:36.624
<v speaker_1>more drugs. But

00:26:36.624 --> 00:26:37.264
<v speaker_1>I know that that

00:26:37.264 --> 00:26:38.424
<v speaker_1>was true, but,

00:26:38.424 --> 00:26:40.034
<v speaker_1>[laughs] so I don't

00:26:40.034 --> 00:26:42.024
<v speaker_1>really know. But,

00:26:42.084 --> 00:26:42.524
<v speaker_1>and then there was

00:26:42.524 --> 00:26:43.664
<v speaker_1>another lesbian bar

00:26:43.664 --> 00:26:44.544
<v speaker_1>down the street from

00:26:44.544 --> 00:26:46.584
<v speaker_1>it where, um...

00:26:49.644 --> 00:26:50.593
<v speaker_1>Well, actually, just, it's

00:26:50.593 --> 00:26:51.404
<v speaker_1>still on Staples

00:26:51.404 --> 00:26:51.764
<v speaker_1>down- I don't know

00:26:51.764 --> 00:26:52.764
<v speaker_1>why Staples, but

00:26:54.884 --> 00:26:55.664
<v speaker_1>kind of down from

00:26:55.664 --> 00:26:56.384
<v speaker_1>where this Gold

00:26:56.384 --> 00:26:57.384
<v speaker_1>Exchange is. I think

00:26:57.384 --> 00:26:59.204
<v speaker_1>it's a cabaret

00:26:59.204 --> 00:27:01.444
<v speaker_1>bar now. Um, that

00:27:01.444 --> 00:27:01.904
<v speaker_1>was where the

00:27:01.904 --> 00:27:03.244
<v speaker_1>lesbians were.

00:27:03.244 --> 00:27:03.924
<v speaker_0>What was it called?

00:27:03.924 --> 00:27:04.123
<v speaker_0>

00:27:04.124 --> 00:27:06.584
<v speaker_1>I cannot remember.

00:27:06.584 --> 00:27:08.264
<v speaker_0>[laughs]

00:27:08.264 --> 00:27:09.424
<v speaker_1>I've been just really

00:27:09.424 --> 00:27:10.744
<v speaker_1>trying really hard

00:27:10.744 --> 00:27:12.904
<v speaker_1>to remember that. Um,

00:27:12.904 --> 00:27:14.124
<v speaker_1>but it's just

00:27:14.124 --> 00:27:16.144
<v speaker_1>left my mind. I

00:27:16.144 --> 00:27:17.364
<v speaker_1>was playing music

00:27:17.364 --> 00:27:18.644
<v speaker_1>at that time, and

00:27:18.644 --> 00:27:19.064
<v speaker_1>it was in

00:27:19.064 --> 00:27:21.024
<v speaker_1>a band, uh, called

00:27:21.024 --> 00:27:21.624
<v speaker_1>Dawn and the

00:27:21.624 --> 00:27:22.124
<v speaker_1>Daves.

00:27:24.664 --> 00:27:25.084
<v speaker_0>Do you still have

00:27:25.084 --> 00:27:26.324
<v speaker_0>recordings of this?

00:27:26.324 --> 00:27:26.744
<v speaker_1>I do.

00:27:26.744 --> 00:27:27.304
<v speaker_0>You do? Oh, you

00:27:27.304 --> 00:27:27.824
<v speaker_0>have to share

00:27:27.824 --> 00:27:28.464
<v speaker_0>that with us.

00:27:28.464 --> 00:27:29.824
<v speaker_1>Uh, two Daves, and,

00:27:29.824 --> 00:27:30.604
<v speaker_1>uh, oh, we

00:27:30.604 --> 00:27:31.024
<v speaker_1>were terrible.

00:27:32.144 --> 00:27:33.254
<v speaker_0>[laughs]

00:27:33.254 --> 00:27:33.604
<v speaker_1>Uh, 'cause I was

00:27:33.604 --> 00:27:34.963
<v speaker_1>drunk and high,

00:27:34.964 --> 00:27:35.904
<v speaker_1>you know? I mean,

00:27:35.904 --> 00:27:37.903
<v speaker_1>really. But then

00:27:37.904 --> 00:27:39.044
<v speaker_1>I had this incredible

00:27:39.044 --> 00:27:39.764
<v speaker_1>voice. I had

00:27:39.764 --> 00:27:41.864
<v speaker_1>this three-octave range.

00:27:41.864 --> 00:27:44.304
<v speaker_1>Um, but we played

00:27:44.304 --> 00:27:45.144
<v speaker_1>in that lesbian

00:27:45.144 --> 00:27:46.464
<v speaker_1>bar a couple of

00:27:46.464 --> 00:27:47.084
<v speaker_1>times, and I

00:27:47.084 --> 00:27:47.844
<v speaker_1>took these two straight

00:27:47.844 --> 00:27:48.544
<v speaker_1>guys in this

00:27:48.544 --> 00:27:49.784
<v speaker_1>bar. And of course,

00:27:49.784 --> 00:27:50.183
<v speaker_1>a bunch of

00:27:50.184 --> 00:27:52.024
<v speaker_1>guys showed up too,

00:27:52.024 --> 00:27:53.024
<v speaker_1>'cause they heard,

00:27:53.024 --> 00:27:54.544
<v speaker_1>right? And, uh, I

00:27:54.544 --> 00:27:55.784
<v speaker_1>was nervous about

00:27:55.784 --> 00:27:56.584
<v speaker_1>how they were gonna

00:27:56.584 --> 00:27:58.404
<v speaker_1>be, these straight

00:27:58.404 --> 00:27:59.284
<v speaker_1>guys, but they had

00:27:59.284 --> 00:28:00.584
<v speaker_1>a great time.

00:28:00.584 --> 00:28:01.954
<v speaker_1>And, um, 'cause, you

00:28:01.954 --> 00:28:02.484
<v speaker_1>know, people were

00:28:02.484 --> 00:28:03.544
<v speaker_1>buying them drinks. Um,

00:28:03.544 --> 00:28:05.224
<v speaker_1>but for me,

00:28:05.224 --> 00:28:05.664
<v speaker_1>I was just a

00:28:05.664 --> 00:28:07.884
<v speaker_1>train wreck, you

00:28:07.884 --> 00:28:08.884
<v speaker_1>know? Because I was

00:28:08.884 --> 00:28:10.764
<v speaker_1>drunk and

00:28:10.764 --> 00:28:13.044
<v speaker_1>high. Um,

00:28:14.444 --> 00:28:15.364
<v speaker_1>so don't do that.

00:28:15.364 --> 00:28:16.664
<v speaker_1>Don't do drugs.

00:28:16.664 --> 00:28:18.044
<v speaker_1>Just say no, children.

00:28:18.044 --> 00:28:20.204
<v speaker_1>Uh, but it

00:28:20.204 --> 00:28:21.104
<v speaker_1>was really good cocaine,

00:28:21.104 --> 00:28:21.964
<v speaker_1>I'm just saying.

00:28:21.964 --> 00:28:24.424
<v speaker_1>Not like now. Um,

00:28:24.424 --> 00:28:25.024
<v speaker_1>I feel very

00:28:25.024 --> 00:28:26.904
<v speaker_1>fortunate that when I

00:28:26.904 --> 00:28:27.364
<v speaker_1>did do all

00:28:27.364 --> 00:28:28.124
<v speaker_1>those drugs, that I

00:28:28.124 --> 00:28:28.664
<v speaker_1>had the good

00:28:28.664 --> 00:28:30.024
<v speaker_1>drugs, [laughs] the real

00:28:30.024 --> 00:28:31.144
<v speaker_1>drugs. Um,

00:28:32.464 --> 00:28:33.084
<v speaker_1>uh, I mean, you

00:28:33.084 --> 00:28:33.444
<v speaker_1>know, but I

00:28:33.444 --> 00:28:34.164
<v speaker_1>was really a train

00:28:34.164 --> 00:28:35.484
<v speaker_1>wreck. Um,

00:28:37.324 --> 00:28:39.584
<v speaker_1>but, uh, it was

00:28:39.584 --> 00:28:40.324
<v speaker_1>a good time.

00:28:41.404 --> 00:28:42.364
<v speaker_1>I, I had fun.

00:28:42.364 --> 00:28:42.364
<v speaker_1>

00:28:43.504 --> 00:28:44.724
<v speaker_0>Are there any, um,

00:28:44.724 --> 00:28:45.544
<v speaker_0>kind of talking

00:28:45.544 --> 00:28:46.004
<v speaker_0>about some of the

00:28:46.004 --> 00:28:47.084
<v speaker_0>individuals throughout the

00:28:47.084 --> 00:28:48.164
<v speaker_0>years, the s- you

00:28:48.164 --> 00:28:49.384
<v speaker_0>know, icons of

00:28:49.384 --> 00:28:50.664
<v speaker_0>the day, especially, you

00:28:50.664 --> 00:28:52.024
<v speaker_0>know, drag performers?

00:28:52.024 --> 00:28:52.844
<v speaker_1>Yeah, so there was

00:28:52.844 --> 00:28:54.204
<v speaker_1>Michelle Lee. I

00:28:54.204 --> 00:28:56.504
<v speaker_1>remember her, and then

00:28:56.504 --> 00:28:57.504
<v speaker_1>that person had

00:28:57.504 --> 00:28:59.164
<v speaker_1>a real-life blood brother

00:28:59.164 --> 00:29:00.304
<v speaker_1>who went by

00:29:00.304 --> 00:29:01.424
<v speaker_1>the name of Priscilla,

00:29:01.424 --> 00:29:02.144
<v speaker_1>who was also

00:29:02.144 --> 00:29:04.624
<v speaker_1>a queen. Uh,

00:29:04.624 --> 00:29:05.684
<v speaker_1>I talked about George.

00:29:05.684 --> 00:29:07.964
<v speaker_1>Um, there was

00:29:07.964 --> 00:29:10.324
<v speaker_1>Buck. There

00:29:10.384 --> 00:29:12.274
<v speaker_1>was the Georges and

00:29:12.274 --> 00:29:13.823
<v speaker_1>the other guy,

00:29:13.824 --> 00:29:14.554
<v speaker_1>um, I can't... the

00:29:14.554 --> 00:29:16.474
<v speaker_1>bartender. Um,

00:29:16.474 --> 00:29:18.524
<v speaker_1>there, women, there

00:29:18.524 --> 00:29:19.164
<v speaker_1>was a woman named

00:29:19.164 --> 00:29:21.344
<v speaker_1>Kat, um,

00:29:22.524 --> 00:29:23.984
<v speaker_1>or Kathleen. Uh,

00:29:26.004 --> 00:29:27.904
<v speaker_1>there was, oh my

00:29:27.904 --> 00:29:29.044
<v speaker_1>God, there was

00:29:29.044 --> 00:29:31.424
<v speaker_1>Marsha, Marsha Lee

00:29:31.424 --> 00:29:33.744
<v speaker_1>Shinus, who was actually

00:29:33.744 --> 00:29:35.184
<v speaker_1>a published playwright.

00:29:37.004 --> 00:29:38.544
<v speaker_1>She moved to New

00:29:38.544 --> 00:29:39.564
<v speaker_1>York. That may

00:29:39.564 --> 00:29:40.164
<v speaker_1>have been why I

00:29:40.164 --> 00:29:40.644
<v speaker_1>went to New

00:29:40.644 --> 00:29:41.624
<v speaker_1>York. I'm not sure.

00:29:41.624 --> 00:29:44.064
<v speaker_1>Um, I cannot

00:29:44.064 --> 00:29:45.224
<v speaker_1>confirm or deny that

00:29:45.224 --> 00:29:47.684
<v speaker_1>story. Um, but

00:29:47.684 --> 00:29:48.564
<v speaker_1>yeah, and Marsha was

00:29:48.564 --> 00:29:49.624
<v speaker_1>from Corpus Christi.

00:29:49.624 --> 00:29:50.664
<v speaker_1>Marsha was actually, at

00:29:50.664 --> 00:29:52.644
<v speaker_1>one point, they,

00:29:52.644 --> 00:29:53.084
<v speaker_1>she was in New

00:29:53.084 --> 00:29:54.264
<v speaker_1>York, and Corpus

00:29:54.264 --> 00:29:55.644
<v speaker_1>Christi Playhouse hired her

00:29:55.644 --> 00:29:57.804
<v speaker_1>to be

00:29:57.804 --> 00:29:59.024
<v speaker_1>the, you know, director

00:29:59.024 --> 00:30:00.564
<v speaker_1>of the playhouse.

00:30:00.564 --> 00:30:01.924
<v speaker_1>Uh, and then they

00:30:01.924 --> 00:30:02.444
<v speaker_1>found out she

00:30:02.444 --> 00:30:04.614
<v speaker_1>was gay. I mean,

00:30:04.614 --> 00:30:05.144
<v speaker_1>she put on

00:30:05.144 --> 00:30:06.424
<v speaker_1>some plays. They found

00:30:06.424 --> 00:30:06.784
<v speaker_1>out she was

00:30:06.784 --> 00:30:07.514
<v speaker_1>a lesbian, so they

00:30:07.514 --> 00:30:08.904
<v speaker_1>fired her.

00:30:08.904 --> 00:30:09.964
<v speaker_0>Wow.

00:30:09.964 --> 00:30:10.504
<v speaker_1>So she went back

00:30:10.504 --> 00:30:11.164
<v speaker_1>to New York.

00:30:12.804 --> 00:30:13.904
<v speaker_1>Um, she has several

00:30:13.904 --> 00:30:15.073
<v speaker_1>published plays. Uh,

00:30:17.104 --> 00:30:18.904
<v speaker_1>Marsha Lee Shinus, uh,

00:30:18.904 --> 00:30:20.004
<v speaker_1>from Ray High

00:30:20.004 --> 00:30:22.716
<v speaker_1>School.So

00:30:22.716 --> 00:30:23.436
<v speaker_1>in fact, at

00:30:23.436 --> 00:30:25.656
<v speaker_1>the Pride Room

00:30:25.656 --> 00:30:27.896
<v speaker_1>in, at the Coastal

00:30:27.896 --> 00:30:28.896
<v speaker_1>Bend Wellness and

00:30:28.896 --> 00:30:30.036
<v speaker_1>the Pride Center, there's

00:30:30.036 --> 00:30:31.516
<v speaker_1>a, uh, a

00:30:31.516 --> 00:30:32.396
<v speaker_1>thing up there with

00:30:32.396 --> 00:30:33.036
<v speaker_1>her name on

00:30:33.036 --> 00:30:34.796
<v speaker_1>it, um, that Good

00:30:34.796 --> 00:30:36.836
<v speaker_1>and I, uh,

00:30:36.836 --> 00:30:38.176
<v speaker_1>purchased to put up

00:30:38.176 --> 00:30:39.076
<v speaker_1>there to commemorate

00:30:39.076 --> 00:30:41.266
<v speaker_1>her. Uh, she's, I

00:30:41.266 --> 00:30:41.896
<v speaker_1>mean, really a

00:30:41.896 --> 00:30:42.756
<v speaker_1>published... Like, one of

00:30:42.756 --> 00:30:43.596
<v speaker_1>her plays was

00:30:43.596 --> 00:30:44.576
<v speaker_1>done and put on

00:30:44.576 --> 00:30:46.656
<v speaker_1>PBS. Um,

00:30:46.656 --> 00:30:48.035
<v speaker_1>so anyway, and

00:30:48.036 --> 00:30:48.516
<v speaker_1>I do, I just

00:30:48.516 --> 00:30:49.556
<v speaker_1>love Marsha. So

00:30:49.556 --> 00:30:50.166
<v speaker_1>there was Marsha, there

00:30:50.166 --> 00:30:52.136
<v speaker_1>was Kat. Um,

00:30:52.136 --> 00:30:53.336
<v speaker_1>there... I can't remember

00:30:53.336 --> 00:30:54.956
<v speaker_1>their names, which

00:30:54.956 --> 00:30:56.936
<v speaker_1>is terrible. Um,

00:31:00.836 --> 00:31:01.916
<v speaker_1>it's prominent people. I

00:31:01.916 --> 00:31:02.776
<v speaker_1>mean, there was

00:31:02.776 --> 00:31:04.546
<v speaker_1>Paul, my friends, there

00:31:04.546 --> 00:31:06.256
<v speaker_1>was James,

00:31:06.256 --> 00:31:08.296
<v speaker_1>there was Corey.

00:31:09.436 --> 00:31:09.946
<v speaker_1>Uh, there was a

00:31:09.946 --> 00:31:11.676
<v speaker_1>guy named Scooter.

00:31:11.676 --> 00:31:13.856
<v speaker_1>He's probably dead. Um,

00:31:13.856 --> 00:31:13.856
<v speaker_1>

00:31:16.796 --> 00:31:17.676
<v speaker_1>the women, so there

00:31:17.676 --> 00:31:18.796
<v speaker_1>was Becky. That's

00:31:18.796 --> 00:31:19.576
<v speaker_1>that woman that broke

00:31:19.576 --> 00:31:21.516
<v speaker_1>my heart. Um,

00:31:21.516 --> 00:31:23.576
<v speaker_1>there was Becky,

00:31:23.576 --> 00:31:24.836
<v speaker_1>there was... Oh my

00:31:24.836 --> 00:31:26.176
<v speaker_1>God, they owned

00:31:26.176 --> 00:31:27.736
<v speaker_1>The Frame Up. Um,

00:31:27.736 --> 00:31:28.576
<v speaker_1>I think her

00:31:28.576 --> 00:31:30.156
<v speaker_1>name was Shelly maybe.

00:31:30.156 --> 00:31:31.756
<v speaker_1>Uh, there was

00:31:31.756 --> 00:31:33.936
<v speaker_1>a Brenda, uh, a

00:31:33.936 --> 00:31:34.836
<v speaker_1>couple of Brendas

00:31:34.836 --> 00:31:37.316
<v speaker_1>actually. And, uh,

00:31:37.316 --> 00:31:38.156
<v speaker_1>there was one Brenda,

00:31:38.156 --> 00:31:38.536
<v speaker_1>and she had

00:31:38.536 --> 00:31:39.466
<v speaker_1>a twin too, and

00:31:39.466 --> 00:31:40.056
<v speaker_1>I can't remember

00:31:40.056 --> 00:31:41.676
<v speaker_1>her name. I'm not

00:31:41.676 --> 00:31:42.416
<v speaker_1>using their last

00:31:42.416 --> 00:31:44.076
<v speaker_1>names because, you know,

00:31:44.076 --> 00:31:44.676
<v speaker_1>that's not my

00:31:44.676 --> 00:31:45.966
<v speaker_1>place. And I don't

00:31:45.966 --> 00:31:46.316
<v speaker_1>know if we

00:31:46.316 --> 00:31:47.356
<v speaker_1>still out people, if

00:31:47.356 --> 00:31:48.495
<v speaker_1>people, if it's

00:31:48.496 --> 00:31:49.356
<v speaker_1>okay to out people

00:31:49.356 --> 00:31:50.916
<v speaker_1>now. But we

00:31:50.916 --> 00:31:51.876
<v speaker_1>don't out in my

00:31:51.876 --> 00:31:53.376
<v speaker_1>world, where I

00:31:53.376 --> 00:31:55.516
<v speaker_1>came from. Um,

00:31:56.976 --> 00:31:57.606
<v speaker_1>I mean, we're really

00:31:57.606 --> 00:31:58.176
<v speaker_1>kind of all

00:31:58.176 --> 00:31:59.316
<v speaker_1>over the place, of

00:31:59.316 --> 00:32:00.576
<v speaker_1>course, you know.

00:32:01.756 --> 00:32:02.116
<v speaker_1>I, uh...

00:32:05.256 --> 00:32:07.556
<v speaker_1>Yeah, Freddie Fender had

00:32:07.556 --> 00:32:08.096
<v speaker_1>a daughter.

00:32:12.556 --> 00:32:12.956
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:32:15.436 --> 00:32:16.416
<v speaker_1>yeah, I can't... I

00:32:16.416 --> 00:32:17.196
<v speaker_1>mean, that was

00:32:17.196 --> 00:32:17.836
<v speaker_1>really the big quee-

00:32:17.836 --> 00:32:18.516
<v speaker_1>I can't remember

00:32:18.516 --> 00:32:19.016
<v speaker_1>a lot of those

00:32:19.016 --> 00:32:19.996
<v speaker_1>queens' names. And

00:32:19.996 --> 00:32:22.156
<v speaker_1>I remember listening to

00:32:22.156 --> 00:32:23.796
<v speaker_1>Britney and, uh,

00:32:23.796 --> 00:32:24.816
<v speaker_1>and her naming off

00:32:24.816 --> 00:32:25.316
<v speaker_1>some of these

00:32:25.316 --> 00:32:26.346
<v speaker_1>queens, but I was

00:32:26.346 --> 00:32:27.256
<v speaker_1>gone.

00:32:27.256 --> 00:32:27.406
<v speaker_0>Mm-hmm.

00:32:29.536 --> 00:32:30.826
<v speaker_1>So I don't remember.

00:32:30.826 --> 00:32:31.435
<v speaker_1>

00:32:31.435 --> 00:32:32.046
<v speaker_0>So let's think about

00:32:32.046 --> 00:32:32.696
<v speaker_0>then when you

00:32:32.696 --> 00:32:34.336
<v speaker_0>returned as well as

00:32:34.336 --> 00:32:35.056
<v speaker_0>how was it

00:32:35.056 --> 00:32:35.816
<v speaker_0>different, how had things

00:32:35.816 --> 00:32:36.516
<v speaker_0>changed?

00:32:36.516 --> 00:32:37.096
<v speaker_1>So when I came

00:32:37.096 --> 00:32:39.576
<v speaker_1>back here, uh,

00:32:39.576 --> 00:32:40.976
<v speaker_1>in 2001, and

00:32:40.976 --> 00:32:42.366
<v speaker_1>we moved back, um,

00:32:42.366 --> 00:32:43.416
<v speaker_1>there was a

00:32:43.416 --> 00:32:44.546
<v speaker_1>women's bar called The

00:32:44.546 --> 00:32:45.196
<v speaker_1>Rose,

00:32:47.356 --> 00:32:48.936
<v speaker_1>also on Staples Street.

00:32:48.936 --> 00:32:50.696
<v speaker_1>Uh, oh God,

00:32:50.696 --> 00:32:51.476
<v speaker_1>you just reminded me

00:32:51.476 --> 00:32:53.136
<v speaker_1>of someone. Um,

00:32:53.136 --> 00:32:54.416
<v speaker_1>so we did

00:32:54.416 --> 00:32:56.016
<v speaker_1>go visit that, uh,

00:32:56.016 --> 00:32:57.356
<v speaker_1>briefly. We went

00:32:57.356 --> 00:32:58.876
<v speaker_1>one time. And as

00:32:58.876 --> 00:32:59.376
<v speaker_1>it turns out,

00:32:59.376 --> 00:33:00.056
<v speaker_1>the woman that owned

00:33:00.056 --> 00:33:01.416
<v speaker_1>that bar, uh,

00:33:01.416 --> 00:33:02.176
<v speaker_1>was somebody I, I

00:33:02.176 --> 00:33:02.776
<v speaker_1>went to school

00:33:02.776 --> 00:33:04.126
<v speaker_1>with as well. [laughs]

00:33:04.126 --> 00:33:05.636
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:33:07.996 --> 00:33:09.496
<v speaker_1>and then there was

00:33:09.496 --> 00:33:10.836
<v speaker_1>The Door had

00:33:10.836 --> 00:33:12.946
<v speaker_1>expanded and become something

00:33:12.946 --> 00:33:15.426
<v speaker_1>completely different. Um,

00:33:16.816 --> 00:33:17.656
<v speaker_1>God, what's her name?

00:33:17.656 --> 00:33:19.536
<v speaker_1>Is it Ida?

00:33:19.536 --> 00:33:21.166
<v speaker_1>Uh, a lesbian who's

00:33:21.166 --> 00:33:21.856
<v speaker_1>very butch. She's

00:33:21.856 --> 00:33:22.796
<v speaker_1>part of the TRE,

00:33:22.796 --> 00:33:25.266
<v speaker_1>um, she's

00:33:25.266 --> 00:33:26.596
<v speaker_1>a cowboy. Um,

00:33:27.736 --> 00:33:28.536
<v speaker_1>I ran into her.

00:33:28.536 --> 00:33:28.996
<v speaker_1>That was kind

00:33:28.996 --> 00:33:29.616
<v speaker_1>of nice to see

00:33:29.616 --> 00:33:30.636
<v speaker_1>an old face

00:33:30.636 --> 00:33:31.656
<v speaker_1>that I knew from

00:33:31.656 --> 00:33:32.476
<v speaker_1>back in the

00:33:32.476 --> 00:33:34.196
<v speaker_1>day, people that were

00:33:34.196 --> 00:33:36.036
<v speaker_1>still alive. Um,

00:33:36.036 --> 00:33:37.296
<v speaker_1>but The Door

00:33:37.296 --> 00:33:38.796
<v speaker_1>had really expanded. And

00:33:38.796 --> 00:33:39.896
<v speaker_1>then of course,

00:33:39.896 --> 00:33:41.356
<v speaker_1>Chris, Aaron Davis,

00:33:42.396 --> 00:33:44.216
<v speaker_1>had these bars, Six,

00:33:44.216 --> 00:33:45.255
<v speaker_1>I think, and

00:33:45.256 --> 00:33:46.776
<v speaker_1>Seven. So let me

00:33:46.776 --> 00:33:47.116
<v speaker_1>tell you about

00:33:47.116 --> 00:33:48.236
<v speaker_1>Chris. So I knew

00:33:48.236 --> 00:33:49.176
<v speaker_1>Chris when Chris

00:33:49.176 --> 00:33:50.236
<v speaker_1>was 18 years old,

00:33:50.236 --> 00:33:51.296
<v speaker_1>just a little

00:33:51.296 --> 00:33:52.676
<v speaker_1>old boy from Ohio

00:33:52.676 --> 00:33:53.976
<v speaker_1>named Chris.

00:33:55.096 --> 00:33:57.236
<v speaker_1>Um, and he was

00:33:57.236 --> 00:33:58.276
<v speaker_1>dating Greg.

00:34:00.016 --> 00:34:00.996
<v speaker_1>God, I loved Greg,

00:34:00.996 --> 00:34:01.876
<v speaker_1>and Greg also

00:34:01.876 --> 00:34:04.336
<v speaker_1>died. AIDS.

00:34:04.336 --> 00:34:04.596
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:34:06.896 --> 00:34:07.766
<v speaker_1>but yeah, Chris was

00:34:07.766 --> 00:34:09.776
<v speaker_1>just this brand-new

00:34:09.776 --> 00:34:11.616
<v speaker_1>sweet boy from Ohio.

00:34:11.616 --> 00:34:12.336
<v speaker_1>And of course,

00:34:12.336 --> 00:34:13.036
<v speaker_1>when I came back

00:34:13.036 --> 00:34:14.336
<v speaker_1>here, Chris was

00:34:14.336 --> 00:34:16.766
<v speaker_1>doing drag and mentoring

00:34:16.766 --> 00:34:17.535
<v speaker_1>people to do

00:34:17.536 --> 00:34:18.696
<v speaker_1>drag and, you know,

00:34:18.696 --> 00:34:20.876
<v speaker_1>by Aaron Davis.

00:34:20.876 --> 00:34:22.536
<v speaker_1>Um, he also is

00:34:22.536 --> 00:34:24.866
<v speaker_1>dead. Um, you

00:34:24.866 --> 00:34:26.576
<v speaker_1>see, a generation

00:34:26.576 --> 00:34:27.035
<v speaker_1>of men.

00:34:29.736 --> 00:34:31.876
<v speaker_1>Um, yeah, so, but

00:34:31.876 --> 00:34:33.336
<v speaker_1>The Door, I

00:34:33.336 --> 00:34:34.926
<v speaker_1>found, had become the

00:34:34.926 --> 00:34:36.656
<v speaker_1>place for the

00:34:36.656 --> 00:34:38.755
<v speaker_1>community. And

00:34:38.755 --> 00:34:40.476
<v speaker_1>let's not forget,

00:34:40.476 --> 00:34:41.296
<v speaker_1>so, and also in

00:34:41.296 --> 00:34:42.076
<v speaker_1>the meantime, while

00:34:42.076 --> 00:34:43.536
<v speaker_1>I was gone, the

00:34:43.536 --> 00:34:44.395
<v speaker_1>Coastal Bend AIDS

00:34:44.396 --> 00:34:45.756
<v speaker_1>Foundation was created.

00:34:47.076 --> 00:34:47.996
<v speaker_1>And my friend Tommy

00:34:47.996 --> 00:34:50.436
<v speaker_1>Landrum, also

00:34:50.436 --> 00:34:52.436
<v speaker_1>dead, uh, was on

00:34:52.436 --> 00:34:53.275
<v speaker_1>that board. And

00:34:53.276 --> 00:34:55.336
<v speaker_1>Tommy [coughs]

00:34:55.336 --> 00:34:56.556
<v speaker_1>was from Beeville,

00:34:56.556 --> 00:34:56.996
<v speaker_1>Texas.

00:34:59.416 --> 00:35:00.476
<v speaker_1>And, uh, a pretty,

00:35:00.476 --> 00:35:01.776
<v speaker_1>you know, well-to-do

00:35:01.776 --> 00:35:03.996
<v speaker_1>affluent man.

00:35:03.996 --> 00:35:05.996
<v speaker_1>Um, but during the

00:35:05.996 --> 00:35:06.596
<v speaker_1>midst of the

00:35:06.596 --> 00:35:08.756
<v speaker_1>AIDS crisis, Tommy would

00:35:08.756 --> 00:35:09.876
<v speaker_1>actually just cruise

00:35:09.876 --> 00:35:11.436
<v speaker_1>around places and hand

00:35:11.436 --> 00:35:12.276
<v speaker_1>out condoms. He

00:35:12.276 --> 00:35:13.716
<v speaker_1>was part of these

00:35:13.716 --> 00:35:14.876
<v speaker_1>grants and, and

00:35:14.876 --> 00:35:15.976
<v speaker_1>worked really hard to

00:35:15.976 --> 00:35:17.416
<v speaker_1>try to make

00:35:17.416 --> 00:35:18.276
<v speaker_1>sure people were being

00:35:18.276 --> 00:35:20.766
<v speaker_1>safe. Um, he

00:35:20.766 --> 00:35:22.216
<v speaker_1>was great. I

00:35:22.216 --> 00:35:23.856
<v speaker_1>loved Tommy. He was

00:35:23.856 --> 00:35:24.556
<v speaker_1>fun to party

00:35:24.556 --> 00:35:26.236
<v speaker_1>with then when I

00:35:26.236 --> 00:35:27.836
<v speaker_1>was drinking, and

00:35:27.836 --> 00:35:28.986
<v speaker_1>he got sober, and

00:35:28.986 --> 00:35:29.576
<v speaker_1>he was still

00:35:29.576 --> 00:35:30.456
<v speaker_1>fun to party with.

00:35:30.456 --> 00:35:32.716
<v speaker_1>Um, just quick

00:35:32.716 --> 00:35:34.396
<v speaker_1>wit. Um, you know,

00:35:34.396 --> 00:35:34.826
<v speaker_1>when he quit

00:35:34.826 --> 00:35:37.276
<v speaker_1>drinking, uh,

00:35:37.276 --> 00:35:37.836
<v speaker_1>one of the liquor

00:35:37.836 --> 00:35:38.676
<v speaker_1>stores in Beeville

00:35:38.676 --> 00:35:39.376
<v speaker_1>actually went out of

00:35:39.376 --> 00:35:40.116
<v speaker_1>business.

00:35:42.096 --> 00:35:42.656
<v speaker_1>I don't know how

00:35:42.656 --> 00:35:43.756
<v speaker_1>connected that is,

00:35:43.756 --> 00:35:45.396
<v speaker_1>but I'm going with

00:35:45.396 --> 00:35:46.876
<v speaker_1>yes. And

00:35:46.876 --> 00:35:48.976
<v speaker_1>[laughs]

00:35:50.476 --> 00:35:51.216
<v speaker_1>Tommy was such a

00:35:51.216 --> 00:35:52.276
<v speaker_1>character and really

00:35:52.276 --> 00:35:53.876
<v speaker_1>well-known here back in

00:35:53.876 --> 00:35:54.776
<v speaker_1>the '80s too.

00:35:54.776 --> 00:35:56.596
<v speaker_1>He, um, oh God,

00:35:56.596 --> 00:35:57.296
<v speaker_1>he was just,

00:35:57.296 --> 00:35:58.096
<v speaker_1>he was so bad.

00:35:58.096 --> 00:35:59.796
<v speaker_1>And I remember

00:35:59.796 --> 00:36:00.656
<v speaker_1>he and his mother

00:36:00.656 --> 00:36:02.556
<v speaker_1>had a flat

00:36:02.556 --> 00:36:04.956
<v speaker_1>tire. And so

00:36:04.956 --> 00:36:05.676
<v speaker_1>they just sat there

00:36:05.676 --> 00:36:06.296
<v speaker_1>in the car

00:36:08.096 --> 00:36:08.856
<v speaker_1>because neither one of

00:36:08.856 --> 00:36:09.376
<v speaker_1>them was gonna

00:36:09.376 --> 00:36:10.096
<v speaker_1>get out. Tommy was

00:36:10.096 --> 00:36:11.335
<v speaker_1>such a queen.

00:36:11.336 --> 00:36:12.056
<v speaker_1>He didn't actually do

00:36:12.056 --> 00:36:12.616
<v speaker_1>drag, but he

00:36:12.616 --> 00:36:13.296
<v speaker_1>was such a queen.

00:36:13.296 --> 00:36:13.686
<v speaker_1>He was like,

00:36:13.686 --> 00:36:14.306
<v speaker_1>"I'm not getting out.

00:36:14.306 --> 00:36:14.756
<v speaker_1>No, I'm not

00:36:14.756 --> 00:36:16.476
<v speaker_1>doing that." Like, they

00:36:16.476 --> 00:36:17.096
<v speaker_1>had to wait

00:36:17.096 --> 00:36:18.396
<v speaker_1>until somebody came along

00:36:18.396 --> 00:36:19.356
<v speaker_1>to change the

00:36:19.356 --> 00:36:19.996
<v speaker_1>tire for them. They

00:36:19.996 --> 00:36:20.696
<v speaker_1>wouldn't even get

00:36:20.696 --> 00:36:21.456
<v speaker_1>out of the car.

00:36:21.456 --> 00:36:22.976
<v speaker_1>You know, I

00:36:22.976 --> 00:36:24.616
<v speaker_1>loved that. Chris Barber

00:36:24.616 --> 00:36:25.316
<v speaker_1>was like that

00:36:25.316 --> 00:36:26.376
<v speaker_1>too. Like, "No, I'm

00:36:26.376 --> 00:36:27.916
<v speaker_1>not getting... No.

00:36:27.916 --> 00:36:29.416
<v speaker_1>[laughs] That's,

00:36:29.416 --> 00:36:31.248
<v speaker_1>no."So then the dykes

00:36:31.248 --> 00:36:32.088
<v speaker_1>would come along,

00:36:32.088 --> 00:36:32.668
<v speaker_1>and we would have

00:36:32.668 --> 00:36:33.148
<v speaker_1>to take care

00:36:33.148 --> 00:36:34.248
<v speaker_1>of everything. So

00:36:35.448 --> 00:36:36.188
<v speaker_0>Speaking a bit to

00:36:36.188 --> 00:36:36.498
<v speaker_0>that-

00:36:36.498 --> 00:36:37.228
<v speaker_1>My tool ba- my

00:36:37.228 --> 00:36:38.437
<v speaker_1>tool bag. Um

00:36:38.437 --> 00:36:39.328
<v speaker_0>... were you aware

00:36:39.328 --> 00:36:40.348
<v speaker_0>of, um, The

00:36:40.348 --> 00:36:42.708
<v speaker_0>Passage and Loving Spoonful

00:36:42.708 --> 00:36:43.228
<v speaker_0>from back in

00:36:43.228 --> 00:36:43.708
<v speaker_0>the day? Or was

00:36:43.708 --> 00:36:45.108
<v speaker_0>that sort of

00:36:45.108 --> 00:36:45.728
<v speaker_0>when you went to

00:36:45.728 --> 00:36:46.627
<v speaker_0>New York?

00:36:46.627 --> 00:36:46.958
<v speaker_1>I think it was

00:36:46.958 --> 00:36:48.088
<v speaker_1>gone. What is

00:36:48.088 --> 00:36:49.228
<v speaker_1>Loving Spoonful?

00:36:49.228 --> 00:36:50.228
<v speaker_0>So Loving Spoonful is

00:36:50.228 --> 00:36:50.908
<v speaker_0>a sort of

00:36:50.908 --> 00:36:53.348
<v speaker_0>a underground sort

00:36:53.348 --> 00:36:55.388
<v speaker_0>of, say, um, way

00:36:55.388 --> 00:36:56.468
<v speaker_0>for, uh, if

00:36:56.468 --> 00:36:58.128
<v speaker_0>you had HIV, um,

00:36:58.128 --> 00:36:58.648
<v speaker_0>that you could

00:36:58.648 --> 00:36:59.168
<v speaker_0>go there and get

00:36:59.168 --> 00:37:00.288
<v speaker_0>food, 'cause otherwise

00:37:00.288 --> 00:37:00.758
<v speaker_0>you may not get

00:37:00.758 --> 00:37:00.788
<v speaker_0>food.

00:37:00.788 --> 00:37:01.827
<v speaker_1>Wonderful.

00:37:01.828 --> 00:37:02.168
<v speaker_0>So.

00:37:02.168 --> 00:37:02.777
<v speaker_1>Yeah, no, I was

00:37:02.777 --> 00:37:03.788
<v speaker_1>completely unaware of

00:37:03.788 --> 00:37:04.058
<v speaker_1>that.

00:37:04.058 --> 00:37:04.068
<v speaker_0>Okay.

00:37:04.068 --> 00:37:04.738
<v speaker_1>But I'm sure that

00:37:04.738 --> 00:37:05.568
<v speaker_1>my friend Tommy

00:37:05.568 --> 00:37:06.508
<v speaker_1>was heavily involved in

00:37:06.508 --> 00:37:07.958
<v speaker_1>that. Um,

00:37:09.208 --> 00:37:09.228
<v speaker_1>yeah.

00:37:09.228 --> 00:37:10.138
<v speaker_0>And equivalent with The

00:37:10.138 --> 00:37:11.388
<v speaker_0>Passage was where

00:37:11.388 --> 00:37:11.888
<v speaker_0>you could go to

00:37:11.888 --> 00:37:13.068
<v speaker_0>die, so.

00:37:13.068 --> 00:37:13.748
<v speaker_1>Yeah.

00:37:13.748 --> 00:37:14.808
<v speaker_0>Um, you know, with

00:37:14.808 --> 00:37:16.708
<v speaker_0>HIV, AIDS, so

00:37:16.708 --> 00:37:17.388
<v speaker_0>during that time.

00:37:17.388 --> 00:37:18.188
<v speaker_1>Yeah, no, that, I

00:37:18.188 --> 00:37:18.628
<v speaker_1>was in New

00:37:18.628 --> 00:37:20.168
<v speaker_1>York with that, so

00:37:20.168 --> 00:37:20.908
<v speaker_1>you know, we're

00:37:20.908 --> 00:37:22.148
<v speaker_1>just watching them die

00:37:22.148 --> 00:37:22.968
<v speaker_1>there.

00:37:22.968 --> 00:37:24.108
<v speaker_0>Right. Right, probably in,

00:37:24.108 --> 00:37:25.568
<v speaker_0>in much more

00:37:25.568 --> 00:37:27.548
<v speaker_0>larger numbers, seriousness. So-

00:37:27.548 --> 00:37:28.108
<v speaker_0>

00:37:28.108 --> 00:37:28.428
<v speaker_1>Yeah

00:37:28.428 --> 00:37:28.528
<v speaker_0>... yeah.

00:37:28.528 --> 00:37:29.668
<v speaker_1>I was really happy

00:37:29.668 --> 00:37:30.388
<v speaker_1>when I came

00:37:30.388 --> 00:37:32.068
<v speaker_1>back to learn that

00:37:32.068 --> 00:37:34.348
<v speaker_1>the Kosovan Wellness

00:37:34.348 --> 00:37:36.228
<v speaker_1>Foundation had expanded

00:37:36.228 --> 00:37:37.348
<v speaker_1>and that it

00:37:37.348 --> 00:37:38.228
<v speaker_1>was working, you know,

00:37:38.228 --> 00:37:39.008
<v speaker_1>in creating a

00:37:39.008 --> 00:37:40.308
<v speaker_1>Pride Center.

00:37:41.488 --> 00:37:42.448
<v speaker_1>I'd been exposed, of

00:37:42.448 --> 00:37:43.168
<v speaker_1>course, to New

00:37:43.168 --> 00:37:44.508
<v speaker_1>York City's Pride Center.

00:37:44.508 --> 00:37:46.788
<v speaker_1>Um, and-

00:37:46.788 --> 00:37:47.548
<v speaker_0>The center

00:37:47.548 --> 00:37:48.648
<v speaker_1>... uh, the center.

00:37:48.648 --> 00:37:49.668
<v speaker_1>Uh,

00:37:51.888 --> 00:37:52.808
<v speaker_1>when I saw it,

00:37:52.808 --> 00:37:53.618
<v speaker_1>though, when it,

00:37:53.618 --> 00:37:54.248
<v speaker_1>it, I was there

00:37:54.248 --> 00:37:54.668
<v speaker_1>when it was

00:37:54.668 --> 00:37:55.848
<v speaker_1>first being created. And

00:37:55.848 --> 00:37:56.628
<v speaker_1>the building was

00:37:56.628 --> 00:37:58.168
<v speaker_1>just wow. You know,

00:37:58.168 --> 00:37:59.298
<v speaker_1>really that needed

00:37:59.298 --> 00:38:00.128
<v speaker_1>a lot of work

00:38:00.128 --> 00:38:00.808
<v speaker_1>is all I'm

00:38:00.808 --> 00:38:01.628
<v speaker_1>saying. There were, may

00:38:01.628 --> 00:38:02.128
<v speaker_1>have been some

00:38:02.128 --> 00:38:03.048
<v speaker_1>cracks in the walls.

00:38:03.048 --> 00:38:04.328
<v speaker_1>I don't know.

00:38:04.328 --> 00:38:06.208
<v speaker_1>Um, but the dykes

00:38:06.208 --> 00:38:06.828
<v speaker_1>were there with

00:38:06.828 --> 00:38:08.868
<v speaker_1>their tool bags and

00:38:08.868 --> 00:38:10.128
<v speaker_1>our power tools,

00:38:10.128 --> 00:38:10.448
<v speaker_1>you know?

00:38:12.828 --> 00:38:14.688
<v speaker_1>[laughs] Um, but I

00:38:14.688 --> 00:38:15.348
<v speaker_1>was really happy

00:38:15.348 --> 00:38:16.788
<v speaker_1>about the Kosovan Wellness

00:38:16.788 --> 00:38:17.608
<v speaker_1>Foundation and about

00:38:17.608 --> 00:38:18.388
<v speaker_1>this Pride Center. And

00:38:18.388 --> 00:38:19.448
<v speaker_1>you know, it,

00:38:21.208 --> 00:38:23.048
<v speaker_1>it saddens me

00:38:25.188 --> 00:38:27.468
<v speaker_1>that this, the

00:38:27.468 --> 00:38:28.948
<v speaker_1>younger people are not

00:38:28.948 --> 00:38:30.708
<v speaker_1>truly taking advantage

00:38:30.708 --> 00:38:31.628
<v speaker_1>of the Pride Center.

00:38:31.628 --> 00:38:33.298
<v speaker_1>I love that

00:38:33.298 --> 00:38:34.478
<v speaker_1>The Hidden Door is

00:38:34.478 --> 00:38:35.448
<v speaker_1>a place for

00:38:35.448 --> 00:38:37.088
<v speaker_1>a community center, like

00:38:37.088 --> 00:38:38.048
<v speaker_1>where the community

00:38:38.048 --> 00:38:39.848
<v speaker_1>is. But, you know,

00:38:39.848 --> 00:38:40.728
<v speaker_1>that is a

00:38:40.728 --> 00:38:42.987
<v speaker_1>bar. And I'm

00:38:42.988 --> 00:38:44.548
<v speaker_1>not downplaying that, but

00:38:44.548 --> 00:38:45.108
<v speaker_1>it is a

00:38:45.108 --> 00:38:47.148
<v speaker_1>bar. And, um,

00:38:48.508 --> 00:38:49.728
<v speaker_1>I, I wish that

00:38:49.728 --> 00:38:50.608
<v speaker_1>there were more

00:38:50.608 --> 00:38:51.508
<v speaker_1>things that people ...

00:38:51.508 --> 00:38:51.848
<v speaker_1>You know, like

00:38:51.848 --> 00:38:52.908
<v speaker_1>the Pride Center does

00:38:52.908 --> 00:38:54.048
<v speaker_1>its part to

00:38:54.048 --> 00:38:56.468
<v speaker_1>try to provide activities

00:38:56.468 --> 00:38:57.528
<v speaker_1>and services and

00:38:57.528 --> 00:38:59.368
<v speaker_1>things, uh, for our

00:38:59.368 --> 00:39:00.608
<v speaker_1>community to participate

00:39:00.608 --> 00:39:02.588
<v speaker_1>in, but we're just

00:39:02.588 --> 00:39:03.568
<v speaker_1>not doing it.

00:39:05.208 --> 00:39:06.148
<v speaker_1>And, you know, we

00:39:06.148 --> 00:39:06.608
<v speaker_1>should.

00:39:08.388 --> 00:39:09.468
<v speaker_1>When we lived in

00:39:09.468 --> 00:39:10.028
<v speaker_1>Utah,

00:39:12.088 --> 00:39:12.668
<v speaker_1>uh, that's where I

00:39:12.668 --> 00:39:14.328
<v speaker_1>met my wife,

00:39:14.328 --> 00:39:16.488
<v speaker_1>um, but they had,

00:39:16.488 --> 00:39:17.328
<v speaker_1>they were just,

00:39:17.328 --> 00:39:18.288
<v speaker_1>had just opened a

00:39:18.288 --> 00:39:20.008
<v speaker_1>small community center

00:39:20.008 --> 00:39:21.608
<v speaker_1>there, LGBT community center.

00:39:21.608 --> 00:39:22.788
<v speaker_1>And it was

00:39:22.788 --> 00:39:25.248
<v speaker_1>vibrant. You

00:39:25.248 --> 00:39:26.168
<v speaker_1>know? It was

00:39:26.168 --> 00:39:27.128
<v speaker_1>vibrant. They had a

00:39:27.128 --> 00:39:28.108
<v speaker_1>lot of activities

00:39:28.108 --> 00:39:28.778
<v speaker_1>going on. They had

00:39:28.778 --> 00:39:30.648
<v speaker_1>open mic nights.

00:39:30.648 --> 00:39:32.548
<v speaker_1>Um, just they had

00:39:32.548 --> 00:39:34.308
<v speaker_1>a coffee shop

00:39:34.308 --> 00:39:34.968
<v speaker_1>in it. You could

00:39:34.968 --> 00:39:35.767
<v speaker_1>just go hang

00:39:35.768 --> 00:39:37.668
<v speaker_1>out there. Um,

00:39:37.668 --> 00:39:39.228
<v speaker_1>uh, I wish

00:39:39.228 --> 00:39:40.268
<v speaker_1>that we would do

00:39:40.268 --> 00:39:41.608
<v speaker_1>that. And, and

00:39:41.608 --> 00:39:42.128
<v speaker_1>it, it's not the

00:39:42.128 --> 00:39:42.608
<v speaker_1>fault of the

00:39:42.608 --> 00:39:43.228
<v speaker_1>Pride Center

00:39:45.308 --> 00:39:46.728
<v speaker_1>because the Pride Center

00:39:46.728 --> 00:39:48.488
<v speaker_1>is, wants to

00:39:48.488 --> 00:39:50.608
<v speaker_1>do these things. But

00:39:50.608 --> 00:39:52.568
<v speaker_1>we need to

00:39:52.568 --> 00:39:54.908
<v speaker_1>support that. And we

00:39:54.908 --> 00:39:56.348
<v speaker_1>as the older

00:39:56.348 --> 00:39:57.528
<v speaker_1>people that no one

00:39:57.528 --> 00:39:58.168
<v speaker_1>wants to be

00:39:58.168 --> 00:39:59.348
<v speaker_1>around 'cause we're old,

00:39:59.348 --> 00:40:00.828
<v speaker_1>and apparently we

00:40:00.828 --> 00:40:01.888
<v speaker_1>don't know anything, you

00:40:01.888 --> 00:40:03.188
<v speaker_1>know. I mean,

00:40:03.188 --> 00:40:04.408
<v speaker_1>I'm a Boomer. You

00:40:04.408 --> 00:40:05.108
<v speaker_1>know, we're the

00:40:05.108 --> 00:40:06.348
<v speaker_1>reason the world is

00:40:06.348 --> 00:40:07.828
<v speaker_1>in the situation

00:40:07.828 --> 00:40:09.348
<v speaker_1>it is [laughs] in.

00:40:09.348 --> 00:40:10.108
<v speaker_1>I, I own

00:40:10.108 --> 00:40:11.508
<v speaker_1>that. Uh,

00:40:13.328 --> 00:40:14.328
<v speaker_1>but, you know, we,

00:40:14.328 --> 00:40:15.168
<v speaker_1>we should be

00:40:15.168 --> 00:40:16.788
<v speaker_1>trying to help. And,

00:40:16.788 --> 00:40:18.588
<v speaker_1>um, you know,

00:40:18.588 --> 00:40:18.968
<v speaker_1>I try to do

00:40:18.968 --> 00:40:20.148
<v speaker_1>my part as

00:40:20.148 --> 00:40:21.268
<v speaker_1>much as I can.

00:40:21.268 --> 00:40:23.558
<v speaker_1>Um, you

00:40:23.558 --> 00:40:25.828
<v speaker_1>know, w- w-

00:40:25.828 --> 00:40:26.528
<v speaker_1>I wish we had

00:40:26.528 --> 00:40:27.588
<v speaker_1>more.

00:40:27.588 --> 00:40:28.068
<v speaker_0>So what would you

00:40:28.068 --> 00:40:29.128
<v speaker_0>say, then, um,

00:40:29.128 --> 00:40:29.848
<v speaker_0>some of the importance

00:40:29.848 --> 00:40:30.628
<v speaker_0>is of the

00:40:30.628 --> 00:40:31.748
<v speaker_0>parade and having that

00:40:31.748 --> 00:40:33.668
<v speaker_0>visibility, um,

00:40:33.668 --> 00:40:35.628
<v speaker_0>especially as the person

00:40:35.628 --> 00:40:36.448
<v speaker_0>who leads the

00:40:36.448 --> 00:40:38.428
<v speaker_0>parade every year? Um,

00:40:38.428 --> 00:40:39.128
<v speaker_0>and maybe even

00:40:39.128 --> 00:40:39.788
<v speaker_0>talk a bit about

00:40:39.788 --> 00:40:40.428
<v speaker_0>the history of

00:40:40.428 --> 00:40:41.368
<v speaker_0>what the Dykes on

00:40:41.368 --> 00:40:42.168
<v speaker_0>Bikes is-

00:40:42.168 --> 00:40:42.368
<v speaker_1>Yeah

00:40:42.368 --> 00:40:42.868
<v speaker_0>... and sort of

00:40:42.868 --> 00:40:43.708
<v speaker_0>what that importance

00:40:43.708 --> 00:40:44.418
<v speaker_0>is to you-

00:40:44.418 --> 00:40:44.418
<v speaker_1>Yeah

00:40:44.418 --> 00:40:45.598
<v speaker_0>... and representing that

00:40:45.598 --> 00:40:45.737
<v speaker_0>way.

00:40:45.737 --> 00:40:46.497
<v speaker_1>Well, I wanna say

00:40:46.497 --> 00:40:47.427
<v speaker_1>thank you very

00:40:47.427 --> 00:40:48.807
<v speaker_1>much for giving me

00:40:48.807 --> 00:40:51.068
<v speaker_1>that privilege, uh,

00:40:51.068 --> 00:40:51.987
<v speaker_1>to lead the parade.

00:40:51.987 --> 00:40:52.608
<v speaker_1>I, I, I

00:40:52.608 --> 00:40:53.548
<v speaker_1>really am grateful for

00:40:53.548 --> 00:40:55.088
<v speaker_1>that, uh, because

00:40:55.088 --> 00:40:55.728
<v speaker_1>it is an honor.

00:40:55.728 --> 00:40:57.928
<v speaker_1>Uh,

00:40:57.928 --> 00:40:59.768
<v speaker_1>so the Pride Parade

00:40:59.768 --> 00:41:01.148
<v speaker_1>is an important

00:41:01.148 --> 00:41:02.928
<v speaker_1>thing because it does

00:41:02.928 --> 00:41:03.468
<v speaker_1>put us out

00:41:03.468 --> 00:41:04.988
<v speaker_1>there. And it lets

00:41:04.988 --> 00:41:06.948
<v speaker_1>kids know

00:41:08.408 --> 00:41:09.648
<v speaker_1>who maybe can't go

00:41:09.648 --> 00:41:10.507
<v speaker_1>to a bar

00:41:10.508 --> 00:41:11.608
<v speaker_1>yet or, you know,

00:41:11.608 --> 00:41:12.668
<v speaker_1>we're here.

00:41:14.168 --> 00:41:15.088
<v speaker_1>And there is a

00:41:15.088 --> 00:41:16.168
<v speaker_1>community for you

00:41:16.168 --> 00:41:17.028
<v speaker_1>to be safe in.

00:41:17.028 --> 00:41:18.888
<v speaker_1>You know? And

00:41:18.888 --> 00:41:20.408
<v speaker_1>you know, kids, young

00:41:20.408 --> 00:41:21.548
<v speaker_1>kids, they couldn't

00:41:21.548 --> 00:41:23.328
<v speaker_1>be safer than with

00:41:23.328 --> 00:41:25.548
<v speaker_1>us because we

00:41:25.548 --> 00:41:27.928
<v speaker_1>know, uh, how it

00:41:27.928 --> 00:41:28.688
<v speaker_1>feels to be

00:41:28.688 --> 00:41:29.468
<v speaker_1>unsafe.

00:41:32.028 --> 00:41:32.908
<v speaker_1>Uh, I have to

00:41:32.908 --> 00:41:33.648
<v speaker_1>go back to

00:41:33.648 --> 00:41:34.828
<v speaker_1>Splash Day. So but

00:41:34.828 --> 00:41:35.448
<v speaker_1>I'm gonna talk

00:41:35.448 --> 00:41:36.488
<v speaker_1>about still with Pride.

00:41:36.488 --> 00:41:38.128
<v speaker_1>So being able

00:41:38.128 --> 00:41:39.908
<v speaker_1>to do that parade

00:41:39.908 --> 00:41:40.828
<v speaker_1>and lead that.

00:41:40.828 --> 00:41:41.968
<v speaker_1>So there is a

00:41:41.968 --> 00:41:44.148
<v speaker_1>huge organization in

00:41:44.148 --> 00:41:45.488
<v speaker_1>San Francisco, and they

00:41:45.488 --> 00:41:46.488
<v speaker_1>have chapters all

00:41:46.488 --> 00:41:47.248
<v speaker_1>over the world, called

00:41:47.248 --> 00:41:48.168
<v speaker_1>Dykes on Bikes.

00:41:48.168 --> 00:41:48.768
<v speaker_1>And it's a real

00:41:48.768 --> 00:41:50.748
<v speaker_1>MC. Um,

00:41:52.528 --> 00:41:53.558
<v speaker_1>and I asked them

00:41:53.558 --> 00:41:54.148
<v speaker_1>if I could

00:41:54.148 --> 00:41:55.808
<v speaker_1>use that name, and

00:41:55.808 --> 00:41:56.377
<v speaker_1>they were like,

00:41:56.377 --> 00:41:58.508
<v speaker_1>"No." Um, because they

00:41:58.508 --> 00:41:59.108
<v speaker_1>had to go

00:41:59.108 --> 00:41:59.628
<v speaker_1>all the way to

00:41:59.628 --> 00:42:01.688
<v speaker_1>the Supreme Court

00:42:01.688 --> 00:42:02.168
<v speaker_1>to be able to

00:42:02.168 --> 00:42:03.428
<v speaker_1>use that name,

00:42:03.428 --> 00:42:04.578
<v speaker_1>Dykes on Bikes,

00:42:05.908 --> 00:42:07.188
<v speaker_1>uh, for their nonprofit

00:42:07.188 --> 00:42:08.127
<v speaker_1>because, you know,

00:42:08.128 --> 00:42:09.278
<v speaker_1>people, "Oh, no. Dykes

00:42:09.278 --> 00:42:10.948
<v speaker_1>is a slur.

00:42:10.948 --> 00:42:12.038
<v speaker_1>You can't use that."

00:42:12.038 --> 00:42:12.507
<v speaker_1>I mean, there

00:42:12.508 --> 00:42:13.668
<v speaker_1>were just ... Like,

00:42:13.668 --> 00:42:14.208
<v speaker_1>the state of

00:42:14.208 --> 00:42:15.918
<v speaker_1>California wouldn't let them,

00:42:15.918 --> 00:42:16.887
<v speaker_1>you know? But

00:42:16.888 --> 00:42:17.708
<v speaker_1>they won that, so

00:42:17.708 --> 00:42:18.588
<v speaker_1>they're very protective

00:42:18.588 --> 00:42:19.658
<v speaker_1>of that. And I

00:42:19.658 --> 00:42:21.108
<v speaker_1>respect that. It

00:42:21.108 --> 00:42:23.288
<v speaker_1>was hard-fought

00:42:23.288 --> 00:42:25.688
<v speaker_1>battle. Um,

00:42:25.688 --> 00:42:26.848
<v speaker_1>so they always lead

00:42:26.848 --> 00:42:27.988
<v speaker_1>the San Francisco

00:42:27.988 --> 00:42:30.218
<v speaker_1>Pride Parade. In New

00:42:30.218 --> 00:42:31.108
<v speaker_1>York City, there's

00:42:31.108 --> 00:42:32.908
<v speaker_1>another group, uh, that

00:42:32.908 --> 00:42:34.148
<v speaker_1>leads that parade.

00:42:34.148 --> 00:42:35.108
<v speaker_1>So the parade is

00:42:35.108 --> 00:42:36.288
<v speaker_1>always led by

00:42:36.288 --> 00:42:37.338
<v speaker_1>the lesbians on their

00:42:37.338 --> 00:42:39.128
<v speaker_1>motorcycles, and then

00:42:39.128 --> 00:42:39.828
<v speaker_1>they let men on

00:42:39.828 --> 00:42:40.488
<v speaker_1>their motors. I

00:42:40.488 --> 00:42:41.428
<v speaker_1>mean, people, you know,

00:42:41.428 --> 00:42:42.567
<v speaker_1>everybody can join.

00:42:42.568 --> 00:42:44.900
<v speaker_1>You know?So here in

00:42:44.900 --> 00:42:47.200
<v speaker_1>Corpus Christi, um,

00:42:47.200 --> 00:42:48.120
<v speaker_1>I love that we

00:42:48.120 --> 00:42:50.260
<v speaker_1>do that, uh,

00:42:50.260 --> 00:42:51.120
<v speaker_1>because it's part of

00:42:51.120 --> 00:42:52.780
<v speaker_1>that tradition. These

00:42:52.780 --> 00:42:54.900
<v speaker_1>bigger Pride parades, they

00:42:54.900 --> 00:42:56.540
<v speaker_1>do that. And,

00:42:56.540 --> 00:42:57.720
<v speaker_1>uh, you know, we're

00:42:57.720 --> 00:42:58.540
<v speaker_1>growing, and we're

00:42:58.540 --> 00:42:59.700
<v speaker_1>gonna be big, too.

00:42:59.700 --> 00:43:00.940
<v speaker_1>Um, so we...

00:43:00.940 --> 00:43:02.170
<v speaker_1>I call our group,

00:43:02.170 --> 00:43:03.980
<v speaker_1>we are Dykes

00:43:03.980 --> 00:43:05.580
<v speaker_1>and Friends on Bikes.

00:43:05.580 --> 00:43:06.899
<v speaker_1>And, uh, and

00:43:06.900 --> 00:43:07.440
<v speaker_1>I invite all my

00:43:07.440 --> 00:43:09.340
<v speaker_1>friends. Uh, and

00:43:09.340 --> 00:43:10.040
<v speaker_1>I've had...

00:43:11.800 --> 00:43:12.480
<v speaker_1>One year we had

00:43:12.480 --> 00:43:13.440
<v speaker_1>some pretty rough

00:43:13.480 --> 00:43:15.040
<v speaker_1>and tough bikers show

00:43:15.040 --> 00:43:17.260
<v speaker_1>up, uh, that

00:43:17.260 --> 00:43:18.660
<v speaker_1>were all cis straight

00:43:18.660 --> 00:43:20.500
<v speaker_1>men. Um,

00:43:20.500 --> 00:43:21.980
<v speaker_1>and they were

00:43:21.980 --> 00:43:23.540
<v speaker_1>like, "Hey, Blaze, you're

00:43:23.540 --> 00:43:24.380
<v speaker_1>doing this? We're

00:43:24.380 --> 00:43:26.380
<v speaker_1>with you." Uh, which

00:43:26.380 --> 00:43:26.940
<v speaker_1>made me very

00:43:26.940 --> 00:43:29.400
<v speaker_1>happy. Um, so

00:43:29.400 --> 00:43:30.380
<v speaker_1>it's a very important

00:43:30.380 --> 00:43:31.040
<v speaker_1>part of it.

00:43:31.040 --> 00:43:32.360
<v speaker_1>But, uh, you've reminded

00:43:32.360 --> 00:43:32.980
<v speaker_1>me of something

00:43:32.980 --> 00:43:34.140
<v speaker_1>that I wanted to

00:43:34.140 --> 00:43:34.820
<v speaker_1>tell you. So

00:43:34.820 --> 00:43:35.700
<v speaker_1>back in the day,

00:43:35.700 --> 00:43:38.140
<v speaker_1>in the

00:43:38.140 --> 00:43:39.060
<v speaker_1>late '70s and the

00:43:39.060 --> 00:43:41.040
<v speaker_1>'80s, the bars,

00:43:41.040 --> 00:43:43.290
<v speaker_1>George, uh, we would

00:43:43.290 --> 00:43:45.000
<v speaker_1>do on, um,

00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:47.440
<v speaker_1>June 27th, 29th, um,

00:43:47.440 --> 00:43:48.940
<v speaker_1>whatever day it

00:43:48.940 --> 00:43:49.560
<v speaker_1>fell on, on a

00:43:49.560 --> 00:43:50.380
<v speaker_1>Saturday, we would

00:43:50.380 --> 00:43:52.770
<v speaker_1>have Splash Day out

00:43:52.770 --> 00:43:53.520
<v speaker_1>on the beach

00:43:53.520 --> 00:43:54.660
<v speaker_1>on Padre. And they

00:43:54.660 --> 00:43:55.440
<v speaker_1>would bring a

00:43:55.440 --> 00:43:57.390
<v speaker_1>flatbed big, like, 18-wheeler

00:43:57.390 --> 00:43:59.380
<v speaker_1>truck out and

00:43:59.380 --> 00:44:01.420
<v speaker_1>with generators and set

00:44:01.420 --> 00:44:03.290
<v speaker_1>up the music,

00:44:03.290 --> 00:44:05.040
<v speaker_1>uh, the amplifiers and

00:44:05.040 --> 00:44:05.720
<v speaker_1>have the disc

00:44:05.720 --> 00:44:06.810
<v speaker_1>jockey there playing all

00:44:06.810 --> 00:44:07.860
<v speaker_1>the music. They

00:44:07.860 --> 00:44:09.420
<v speaker_1>would bring beer, just

00:44:09.420 --> 00:44:10.300
<v speaker_1>kegs and kegs

00:44:10.300 --> 00:44:12.220
<v speaker_1>of beer. A- yeah.

00:44:12.220 --> 00:44:12.940
<v speaker_1>Oh, it was

00:44:12.940 --> 00:44:13.900
<v speaker_1>quite the party for

00:44:13.900 --> 00:44:15.250
<v speaker_1>us. And people

00:44:15.250 --> 00:44:15.720
<v speaker_1>would show up with

00:44:15.720 --> 00:44:17.320
<v speaker_1>their pop-ups and,

00:44:17.320 --> 00:44:18.680
<v speaker_1>you know, uh, and

00:44:18.680 --> 00:44:20.160
<v speaker_1>we just partied

00:44:20.160 --> 00:44:21.940
<v speaker_1>all day long out

00:44:21.940 --> 00:44:22.900
<v speaker_1>there, and the

00:44:22.900 --> 00:44:24.400
<v speaker_1>bars supported that. They

00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:25.500
<v speaker_1>made that happen.

00:44:26.560 --> 00:44:27.440
<v speaker_1>Uh, when I came

00:44:27.440 --> 00:44:29.440
<v speaker_1>back to

00:44:29.440 --> 00:44:31.920
<v speaker_1>Texas in 2001, there

00:44:31.920 --> 00:44:32.960
<v speaker_1>was a Splash

00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:33.820
<v speaker_1>Day, and I think

00:44:33.820 --> 00:44:35.160
<v speaker_1>something happened with

00:44:35.160 --> 00:44:37.080
<v speaker_1>egos, right? You know,

00:44:37.080 --> 00:44:37.680
<v speaker_1>there was some

00:44:37.680 --> 00:44:38.560
<v speaker_1>group that was doing

00:44:38.560 --> 00:44:39.000
<v speaker_1>it, and then

00:44:39.000 --> 00:44:40.060
<v speaker_1>another group said they

00:44:40.060 --> 00:44:41.240
<v speaker_1>owned it, and

00:44:41.240 --> 00:44:42.250
<v speaker_1>then it became this

00:44:42.250 --> 00:44:42.920
<v speaker_1>ego thing, and

00:44:42.920 --> 00:44:44.280
<v speaker_1>I'm like, "That's so

00:44:44.280 --> 00:44:44.840
<v speaker_1>stupid.

00:44:47.060 --> 00:44:47.560
<v speaker_1>Why can't we just

00:44:47.560 --> 00:44:48.720
<v speaker_1>all go there?"

00:44:48.720 --> 00:44:49.900
<v speaker_1>It's not about ownership.

00:44:49.900 --> 00:44:52.200
<v speaker_1>You know, we

00:44:52.200 --> 00:44:52.850
<v speaker_1>have to really put

00:44:52.850 --> 00:44:53.880
<v speaker_1>our egos aside.

00:44:54.900 --> 00:44:55.780
<v speaker_1>It's not about pat

00:44:55.780 --> 00:44:56.160
<v speaker_1>me on the

00:44:56.160 --> 00:44:56.820
<v speaker_1>back and give me

00:44:56.820 --> 00:44:59.260
<v speaker_1>a crown, um,

00:44:59.260 --> 00:44:59.780
<v speaker_1>'cause I already have

00:44:59.780 --> 00:45:00.600
<v speaker_1>my own tiara.

00:45:00.600 --> 00:45:02.070
<v speaker_1>Thank you. Uh, bought

00:45:02.070 --> 00:45:03.580
<v speaker_1>it on Amazon.

00:45:03.580 --> 00:45:05.660
<v speaker_1>Uh, [laughs]

00:45:07.740 --> 00:45:09.200
<v speaker_1>we need to just

00:45:09.200 --> 00:45:10.680
<v speaker_1>support each other

00:45:10.680 --> 00:45:11.800
<v speaker_1>in whatever it is

00:45:11.800 --> 00:45:12.740
<v speaker_1>we're doing to

00:45:12.740 --> 00:45:13.660
<v speaker_1>try to better our

00:45:13.660 --> 00:45:14.360
<v speaker_1>community

00:45:16.180 --> 00:45:18.280
<v speaker_1>and provide for

00:45:18.280 --> 00:45:20.680
<v speaker_1>organizations that help our

00:45:20.680 --> 00:45:21.860
<v speaker_1>community.

00:45:23.760 --> 00:45:25.160
<v speaker_1>Uh, uh, us first.

00:45:25.160 --> 00:45:27.620
<v speaker_1>Yeah,

00:45:27.620 --> 00:45:28.520
<v speaker_1>I said it. Us

00:45:28.520 --> 00:45:30.079
<v speaker_1>first. Then we

00:45:30.080 --> 00:45:31.430
<v speaker_1>can reach out into

00:45:31.430 --> 00:45:32.780
<v speaker_1>other organizations or

00:45:32.780 --> 00:45:34.300
<v speaker_1>other places, but us

00:45:34.300 --> 00:45:36.740
<v speaker_1>first. Um, 'cause

00:45:36.740 --> 00:45:37.640
<v speaker_1>we are truly the

00:45:37.640 --> 00:45:38.400
<v speaker_1>one, when push

00:45:38.400 --> 00:45:39.720
<v speaker_1>comes to shove, who

00:45:39.720 --> 00:45:40.299
<v speaker_1>are actually gonna

00:45:40.300 --> 00:45:40.820
<v speaker_1>look out for one

00:45:40.820 --> 00:45:43.180
<v speaker_1>another. You know,

00:45:43.180 --> 00:45:44.600
<v speaker_1>it's the bars. When

00:45:44.600 --> 00:45:45.820
<v speaker_1>some kid is

00:45:45.820 --> 00:45:46.940
<v speaker_1>14 or 15 years

00:45:46.940 --> 00:45:48.060
<v speaker_1>old and trying

00:45:48.060 --> 00:45:48.700
<v speaker_1>to figure out their

00:45:48.700 --> 00:45:51.100
<v speaker_1>sexuality, it's

00:45:51.100 --> 00:45:53.420
<v speaker_1>the bars that

00:45:53.420 --> 00:45:54.360
<v speaker_1>they're gonna go to.

00:45:54.360 --> 00:45:56.760
<v speaker_1>That may

00:45:56.760 --> 00:45:57.640
<v speaker_1>not be the best

00:45:57.640 --> 00:45:58.480
<v speaker_1>place to go.

00:46:00.160 --> 00:46:00.300
<v speaker_1>Um...

00:46:01.440 --> 00:46:02.200
<v speaker_2>What would you say

00:46:02.200 --> 00:46:03.560
<v speaker_2>to a version

00:46:03.560 --> 00:46:04.680
<v speaker_2>of yourself that would

00:46:04.680 --> 00:46:06.120
<v speaker_2>be 14, 15

00:46:06.120 --> 00:46:07.040
<v speaker_2>years old now?

00:46:07.040 --> 00:46:08.220
<v speaker_1>Yeah. So I've thought

00:46:08.220 --> 00:46:08.780
<v speaker_1>about that a

00:46:08.780 --> 00:46:11.200
<v speaker_1>lot. When

00:46:11.200 --> 00:46:12.360
<v speaker_1>I was a

00:46:12.360 --> 00:46:13.920
<v speaker_1>little girl, I

00:46:15.100 --> 00:46:15.920
<v speaker_1>always wanted to be

00:46:15.920 --> 00:46:16.660
<v speaker_1>with the boys,

00:46:16.660 --> 00:46:17.380
<v speaker_1>and I wanted to

00:46:17.380 --> 00:46:18.139
<v speaker_1>be a boy.

00:46:21.580 --> 00:46:24.020
<v speaker_1>Um, were I

00:46:24.020 --> 00:46:25.480
<v speaker_1>that age today,

00:46:27.820 --> 00:46:29.660
<v speaker_1>uh, I would probably

00:46:29.660 --> 00:46:31.660
<v speaker_1>be talking to

00:46:31.660 --> 00:46:33.870
<v speaker_1>Brittany and Katana and

00:46:33.870 --> 00:46:36.120
<v speaker_1>whoever about

00:46:36.120 --> 00:46:37.080
<v speaker_1>doing some type of

00:46:37.080 --> 00:46:37.810
<v speaker_1>transitioning.

00:46:41.160 --> 00:46:42.510
<v speaker_1>Um, because I, I

00:46:42.510 --> 00:46:43.500
<v speaker_1>do. I mean,

00:46:43.500 --> 00:46:44.260
<v speaker_1>she'll tell you, I

00:46:44.260 --> 00:46:46.240
<v speaker_1>think very male.

00:46:46.240 --> 00:46:46.640
<v speaker_1>Um,

00:46:48.760 --> 00:46:50.200
<v speaker_1>she knows because she's,

00:46:50.200 --> 00:46:51.480
<v speaker_1>like, knows about

00:46:51.480 --> 00:46:52.880
<v speaker_1>men. I don't. But,

00:46:52.880 --> 00:46:53.840
<v speaker_1>um,

00:46:55.200 --> 00:46:57.620
<v speaker_1>[laughs] so I, I

00:46:57.620 --> 00:46:58.520
<v speaker_1>would probably do

00:46:58.520 --> 00:47:00.040
<v speaker_1>that. Uh, you know,

00:47:00.040 --> 00:47:00.739
<v speaker_1>the-- on the

00:47:00.739 --> 00:47:01.580
<v speaker_1>other hand, though, for

00:47:01.580 --> 00:47:02.739
<v speaker_1>me, because that

00:47:02.739 --> 00:47:03.320
<v speaker_1>was not really an

00:47:03.320 --> 00:47:03.980
<v speaker_1>option in my

00:47:03.980 --> 00:47:06.320
<v speaker_1>world at that time

00:47:06.320 --> 00:47:07.320
<v speaker_1>and, you know,

00:47:07.320 --> 00:47:07.800
<v speaker_1>and then I went

00:47:07.800 --> 00:47:08.900
<v speaker_1>into AA and,

00:47:08.900 --> 00:47:09.360
<v speaker_1>you know, and I'm

00:47:09.360 --> 00:47:10.960
<v speaker_1>sober and, you

00:47:10.960 --> 00:47:11.440
<v speaker_1>know, I had to

00:47:11.440 --> 00:47:12.439
<v speaker_1>like, you know,

00:47:12.440 --> 00:47:13.660
<v speaker_1>figure things out on

00:47:13.660 --> 00:47:15.760
<v speaker_1>my own and,

00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:16.700
<v speaker_1>you know, AA taught

00:47:16.700 --> 00:47:17.720
<v speaker_1>me, you know,

00:47:17.720 --> 00:47:19.320
<v speaker_1>how to do self-love

00:47:19.320 --> 00:47:20.740
<v speaker_1>and love me

00:47:20.740 --> 00:47:21.500
<v speaker_1>just the way I

00:47:21.500 --> 00:47:22.760
<v speaker_1>am. I am

00:47:22.760 --> 00:47:24.840
<v speaker_1>perfect the way I

00:47:24.840 --> 00:47:27.320
<v speaker_1>am. Uh, you

00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:28.300
<v speaker_1>know, I am who

00:47:28.300 --> 00:47:29.080
<v speaker_1>I am, and

00:47:29.080 --> 00:47:29.970
<v speaker_1>there's nothing wrong with

00:47:29.970 --> 00:47:31.500
<v speaker_1>me. Um,

00:47:33.060 --> 00:47:34.110
<v speaker_1>so I would not

00:47:34.110 --> 00:47:36.140
<v speaker_1>transition today.

00:47:36.140 --> 00:47:37.840
<v speaker_1>Um, though I do

00:47:37.840 --> 00:47:38.180
<v speaker_1>get a lot

00:47:38.180 --> 00:47:38.620
<v speaker_1>of shit, and we

00:47:38.620 --> 00:47:39.280
<v speaker_1>talked about this

00:47:39.280 --> 00:47:41.120
<v speaker_1>earlier, uh, when I

00:47:41.120 --> 00:47:42.819
<v speaker_1>go to, um,

00:47:42.820 --> 00:47:45.020
<v speaker_1>bathrooms, public bathrooms,

00:47:45.020 --> 00:47:46.380
<v speaker_1>like we stop at

00:47:46.380 --> 00:47:47.180
<v speaker_1>a gas station,

00:47:47.180 --> 00:47:47.930
<v speaker_1>fill up, and I

00:47:47.930 --> 00:47:48.480
<v speaker_1>wanna go into

00:47:48.480 --> 00:47:49.820
<v speaker_1>the women's room. I

00:47:49.820 --> 00:47:50.700
<v speaker_1>cannot tell you

00:47:50.700 --> 00:47:51.670
<v speaker_1>the number of times

00:47:51.670 --> 00:47:53.020
<v speaker_1>I'm stopped if

00:47:53.020 --> 00:47:53.980
<v speaker_1>there's a woman coming

00:47:53.980 --> 00:47:55.060
<v speaker_1>out that says,

00:47:55.060 --> 00:47:56.700
<v speaker_1>"Excuse me, but this

00:47:56.700 --> 00:47:57.340
<v speaker_1>is the women's

00:47:57.340 --> 00:47:59.240
<v speaker_1>restroom." I'm like,

00:47:59.240 --> 00:48:01.320
<v speaker_1>"Yeah." You know,

00:48:01.320 --> 00:48:03.740
<v speaker_1>I mean, [clears throat] it

00:48:03.740 --> 00:48:05.460
<v speaker_1>is not the

00:48:05.460 --> 00:48:07.340
<v speaker_1>actual trans

00:48:07.340 --> 00:48:08.860
<v speaker_1>women who are getting

00:48:08.860 --> 00:48:09.980
<v speaker_1>stopped going into

00:48:09.980 --> 00:48:11.840
<v speaker_1>the bathroom because of

00:48:11.840 --> 00:48:12.380
<v speaker_1>all of this

00:48:12.380 --> 00:48:14.100
<v speaker_1>stupid bathroom crap, right?

00:48:14.100 --> 00:48:15.759
<v speaker_1>It's me.

00:48:15.759 --> 00:48:17.590
<v speaker_1>[laughs] I am not

00:48:17.590 --> 00:48:19.680
<v speaker_1>a trans woman.

00:48:19.680 --> 00:48:20.200
<v speaker_1>I am a cis

00:48:20.200 --> 00:48:22.380
<v speaker_1>woman. [clears throat] And

00:48:22.380 --> 00:48:23.680
<v speaker_1>I have started recently,

00:48:23.680 --> 00:48:24.540
<v speaker_1>when this happens

00:48:24.540 --> 00:48:26.830
<v speaker_1>to me, of, of

00:48:26.830 --> 00:48:27.900
<v speaker_1>literally just lifting

00:48:27.900 --> 00:48:29.010
<v speaker_1>up my shirt, and

00:48:29.010 --> 00:48:29.920
<v speaker_1>my tits say

00:48:29.920 --> 00:48:30.580
<v speaker_1>I can be here.

00:48:30.580 --> 00:48:33.060
<v speaker_1>Um, and then

00:48:33.060 --> 00:48:33.560
<v speaker_1>I do try

00:48:33.560 --> 00:48:34.500
<v speaker_1>to do some educating.

00:48:34.500 --> 00:48:35.200
<v speaker_1>It depends on

00:48:35.200 --> 00:48:35.980
<v speaker_1>my mood at the

00:48:35.980 --> 00:48:37.600
<v speaker_1>time. Uh, and

00:48:37.600 --> 00:48:38.040
<v speaker_1>I will try to

00:48:38.040 --> 00:48:39.240
<v speaker_1>educate that, you

00:48:39.240 --> 00:48:40.840
<v speaker_1>know. The... If a

00:48:40.840 --> 00:48:41.840
<v speaker_1>man actually walked

00:48:41.840 --> 00:48:42.460
<v speaker_1>in here, it would

00:48:42.460 --> 00:48:43.060
<v speaker_1>take them that

00:48:43.060 --> 00:48:43.780
<v speaker_1>long to figure out

00:48:43.780 --> 00:48:44.220
<v speaker_1>I'm in the

00:48:44.220 --> 00:48:46.560
<v speaker_1>wrong place 'cause

00:48:46.560 --> 00:48:47.920
<v speaker_1>men's restrooms have

00:48:47.920 --> 00:48:48.700
<v speaker_1>urinals all over the

00:48:48.700 --> 00:48:50.480
<v speaker_1>place. This one

00:48:50.480 --> 00:48:52.564
<v speaker_1>does not.Um,

00:48:52.564 --> 00:48:54.264
<v speaker_1>so that is

00:48:54.264 --> 00:48:55.924
<v speaker_1>frustrating. Um,

00:48:57.404 --> 00:48:58.434
<v speaker_1>you know, and, you

00:48:58.434 --> 00:48:58.923
<v speaker_1>know, I do

00:48:58.924 --> 00:49:00.104
<v speaker_1>present very male and

00:49:00.104 --> 00:49:00.984
<v speaker_1>I, I understand

00:49:00.984 --> 00:49:01.844
<v speaker_1>that. Uh, but I

00:49:01.844 --> 00:49:02.844
<v speaker_1>had a woman

00:49:02.844 --> 00:49:05.284
<v speaker_1>share with me something,

00:49:05.284 --> 00:49:05.924
<v speaker_1>'cause I, I

00:49:05.924 --> 00:49:06.764
<v speaker_1>used those terms. I

00:49:06.764 --> 00:49:07.144
<v speaker_1>said, "You know,

00:49:07.144 --> 00:49:08.164
<v speaker_1>I present very male."

00:49:08.164 --> 00:49:10.174
<v speaker_1>And she said,

00:49:11.244 --> 00:49:11.964
<v speaker_1>"How so?" And I

00:49:11.964 --> 00:49:12.284
<v speaker_1>said, "Well, you

00:49:12.284 --> 00:49:12.804
<v speaker_1>know, I always wear

00:49:12.804 --> 00:49:14.544
<v speaker_1>men's clothing." And

00:49:14.544 --> 00:49:16.994
<v speaker_1>she's like, "Well, you're

00:49:16.994 --> 00:49:17.764
<v speaker_1>a woman, right?"

00:49:17.764 --> 00:49:18.834
<v speaker_1>I said, "Yes." "And

00:49:18.834 --> 00:49:20.144
<v speaker_1>you're wearing clothes."

00:49:20.144 --> 00:49:20.994
<v speaker_1>"Yes." "Well, then they're

00:49:20.994 --> 00:49:22.004
<v speaker_1>women's clothes."

00:49:25.084 --> 00:49:25.904
<v speaker_1>That's correct.

00:49:27.544 --> 00:49:29.524
<v speaker_1>So that helped me

00:49:29.524 --> 00:49:32.004
<v speaker_1>kind of... Uh,

00:49:32.004 --> 00:49:32.884
<v speaker_1>uh, I- I mean,

00:49:32.884 --> 00:49:33.584
<v speaker_1>I just am

00:49:33.584 --> 00:49:35.264
<v speaker_1>who I am. You

00:49:35.264 --> 00:49:35.884
<v speaker_1>know, I'm old.

00:49:37.944 --> 00:49:39.004
<v speaker_1>I'm 65.

00:49:40.324 --> 00:49:41.104
<v speaker_4>Well, thinking about with

00:49:41.104 --> 00:49:42.204
<v speaker_4>your wisdom-

00:49:42.204 --> 00:49:42.904
<v speaker_1>Oh, God

00:49:42.904 --> 00:49:43.733
<v speaker_4>... you could apply,

00:49:43.733 --> 00:49:45.364
<v speaker_4>um, especially, you

00:49:45.364 --> 00:49:46.344
<v speaker_4>know, we, uh, kind

00:49:46.344 --> 00:49:47.464
<v speaker_4>of thinking a

00:49:47.464 --> 00:49:48.104
<v speaker_4>year or two ago,

00:49:48.104 --> 00:49:48.544
<v speaker_4>or I guess

00:49:48.544 --> 00:49:49.144
<v speaker_4>it was a year...

00:49:49.144 --> 00:49:49.624
<v speaker_4>Oh, my gosh.

00:49:49.624 --> 00:49:50.124
<v speaker_4>Has it almost been

00:49:50.124 --> 00:49:51.284
<v speaker_4>two years ago?

00:49:51.284 --> 00:49:52.474
<v speaker_4>Um, and we had

00:49:52.474 --> 00:49:53.084
<v speaker_4>that event that

00:49:53.144 --> 00:49:53.744
<v speaker_4>was at The Hidden

00:49:53.744 --> 00:49:54.224
<v speaker_4>Door, and you

00:49:54.224 --> 00:49:54.954
<v speaker_4>were sitting with that

00:49:54.954 --> 00:49:56.704
<v speaker_4>couple. Um, what

00:49:56.704 --> 00:49:58.024
<v speaker_4>would you say kind

00:49:58.024 --> 00:49:58.644
<v speaker_4>of in more

00:49:58.644 --> 00:49:59.764
<v speaker_4>general sense, not to

00:49:59.764 --> 00:50:01.064
<v speaker_4>them specifically, but

00:50:01.064 --> 00:50:03.164
<v speaker_4>to anyone who's LGBT

00:50:03.164 --> 00:50:03.904
<v speaker_4>youth kind of

00:50:03.904 --> 00:50:06.264
<v speaker_4>right now in 2026

00:50:06.264 --> 00:50:07.104
<v speaker_4>sort of going

00:50:07.104 --> 00:50:08.684
<v speaker_4>through, um, what they're

00:50:08.684 --> 00:50:09.424
<v speaker_4>doing and ha-

00:50:09.424 --> 00:50:11.164
<v speaker_4>maybe how isolated some

00:50:11.164 --> 00:50:11.984
<v speaker_4>of them might

00:50:11.984 --> 00:50:12.824
<v speaker_4>feel?

00:50:12.904 --> 00:50:13.864
<v speaker_1>So the first thing

00:50:13.864 --> 00:50:14.424
<v speaker_1>I would say

00:50:14.424 --> 00:50:15.254
<v speaker_1>is it does get

00:50:15.254 --> 00:50:17.584
<v speaker_1>better. It's gonna

00:50:17.584 --> 00:50:19.534
<v speaker_1>get better. You know,

00:50:19.534 --> 00:50:20.344
<v speaker_1>you just gotta

00:50:20.344 --> 00:50:21.324
<v speaker_1>keep your head down,

00:50:21.324 --> 00:50:23.183
<v speaker_1>stay focused, and

00:50:23.184 --> 00:50:23.764
<v speaker_1>get out of high

00:50:23.764 --> 00:50:24.084
<v speaker_1>school.

00:50:26.384 --> 00:50:27.224
<v speaker_1>Because it will get

00:50:27.224 --> 00:50:29.524
<v speaker_1>better. Turn 18.

00:50:29.524 --> 00:50:30.444
<v speaker_1>It will get better.

00:50:30.444 --> 00:50:32.934
<v speaker_1>You know,

00:50:32.934 --> 00:50:34.644
<v speaker_1>come and then

00:50:34.644 --> 00:50:35.514
<v speaker_1>come be with us

00:50:35.514 --> 00:50:36.804
<v speaker_1>because we will

00:50:36.804 --> 00:50:38.804
<v speaker_1>help you. You know,

00:50:38.804 --> 00:50:40.084
<v speaker_1>we have families

00:50:40.084 --> 00:50:41.104
<v speaker_1>of choice, right? We

00:50:41.104 --> 00:50:41.924
<v speaker_1>have the families

00:50:41.924 --> 00:50:43.364
<v speaker_1>that we're born into,

00:50:43.364 --> 00:50:43.784
<v speaker_1>and a lot

00:50:43.784 --> 00:50:44.804
<v speaker_1>of times they just

00:50:44.804 --> 00:50:46.104
<v speaker_1>kick us out.

00:50:46.104 --> 00:50:46.944
<v speaker_1>I was a fortunate

00:50:46.944 --> 00:50:47.764
<v speaker_1>person with my

00:50:47.764 --> 00:50:49.564
<v speaker_1>mother, and, uh, I

00:50:49.564 --> 00:50:50.224
<v speaker_1>will always be

00:50:50.224 --> 00:50:51.084
<v speaker_1>grateful for that. But

00:50:51.084 --> 00:50:52.964
<v speaker_1>my father, no,

00:50:52.964 --> 00:50:55.044
<v speaker_1>we were done. Um,

00:50:55.044 --> 00:50:57.444
<v speaker_1>and, and other

00:50:57.444 --> 00:50:58.644
<v speaker_1>kids, though, it's

00:50:58.644 --> 00:50:59.824
<v speaker_1>worse for them. You

00:50:59.824 --> 00:51:00.324
<v speaker_1>know, they just

00:51:00.324 --> 00:51:00.984
<v speaker_1>get kicked out of

00:51:00.984 --> 00:51:01.883
<v speaker_1>the house. So

00:51:01.884 --> 00:51:02.484
<v speaker_1>just keep your head

00:51:02.484 --> 00:51:04.223
<v speaker_1>down, it will

00:51:04.224 --> 00:51:05.384
<v speaker_1>get better, and come

00:51:05.384 --> 00:51:06.324
<v speaker_1>to us because

00:51:06.324 --> 00:51:06.964
<v speaker_1>we will be your

00:51:06.964 --> 00:51:09.223
<v speaker_1>family. We'll be

00:51:09.224 --> 00:51:10.324
<v speaker_1>your family of choice.

00:51:10.324 --> 00:51:11.584
<v speaker_1>We will be

00:51:11.584 --> 00:51:12.264
<v speaker_1>the ones that are

00:51:12.264 --> 00:51:13.424
<v speaker_1>there for you.

00:51:13.484 --> 00:51:14.284
<v speaker_1>We will help you

00:51:14.284 --> 00:51:15.104
<v speaker_1>figure out how

00:51:15.104 --> 00:51:16.464
<v speaker_1>to date. Like, when

00:51:16.464 --> 00:51:17.633
<v speaker_1>I came out,

00:51:17.633 --> 00:51:18.364
<v speaker_1>'cause I hadn't really

00:51:18.364 --> 00:51:19.304
<v speaker_1>dated in high

00:51:19.304 --> 00:51:20.484
<v speaker_1>school, and I really

00:51:20.484 --> 00:51:21.264
<v speaker_1>hadn't been attracted

00:51:21.264 --> 00:51:22.704
<v speaker_1>to men, you know?

00:51:22.704 --> 00:51:23.253
<v speaker_1>I was attracted

00:51:23.253 --> 00:51:25.204
<v speaker_1>to women, but really

00:51:25.204 --> 00:51:25.964
<v speaker_1>wouldn't date them,

00:51:25.964 --> 00:51:26.454
<v speaker_1>right? You know, I

00:51:26.454 --> 00:51:26.944
<v speaker_1>was just sitting

00:51:26.944 --> 00:51:28.864
<v speaker_1>back having crushes. Um-

00:51:28.864 --> 00:51:29.324
<v speaker_1>

00:51:29.324 --> 00:51:31.224
<v speaker_4>Oh, my God. On

00:51:31.224 --> 00:51:32.424
<v speaker_4>Susan Schlesinger.

00:51:33.744 --> 00:51:34.364
<v speaker_1>Susan, I hope you

00:51:34.364 --> 00:51:36.484
<v speaker_1>see this. Um,

00:51:38.144 --> 00:51:39.324
<v speaker_1>but, um, you know,

00:51:39.324 --> 00:51:39.684
<v speaker_1>I didn't know

00:51:39.684 --> 00:51:40.524
<v speaker_1>how to date. I

00:51:40.524 --> 00:51:41.044
<v speaker_1>di- I did

00:51:41.044 --> 00:51:42.504
<v speaker_1>not know how to

00:51:42.504 --> 00:51:43.284
<v speaker_1>do any of

00:51:43.324 --> 00:51:44.584
<v speaker_1>those things, right? So

00:51:44.584 --> 00:51:46.204
<v speaker_1>it was older

00:51:46.204 --> 00:51:47.004
<v speaker_1>lesbians

00:51:49.064 --> 00:51:50.464
<v speaker_1>that taught me

00:51:52.224 --> 00:51:53.284
<v speaker_1>and sh- taught, you

00:51:53.284 --> 00:51:54.504
<v speaker_1>know, they shared

00:51:54.504 --> 00:51:55.824
<v speaker_1>things with me. I

00:51:55.824 --> 00:51:56.884
<v speaker_1>remember getting slapped

00:51:56.884 --> 00:51:59.004
<v speaker_1>down really quick,

00:51:59.004 --> 00:52:00.604
<v speaker_1>um, by a big

00:52:00.604 --> 00:52:03.024
<v speaker_1>feminist, uh, who

00:52:03.024 --> 00:52:04.394
<v speaker_1>sa- I said, "Well,

00:52:04.394 --> 00:52:04.744
<v speaker_1>yeah, I went

00:52:04.744 --> 00:52:05.624
<v speaker_1>out with this girl,

00:52:05.624 --> 00:52:06.204
<v speaker_1>and then I

00:52:06.204 --> 00:52:06.784
<v speaker_1>went out with this

00:52:06.784 --> 00:52:08.324
<v speaker_1>girl. This girl

00:52:08.324 --> 00:52:09.154
<v speaker_1>is, like, somebody you'd

00:52:09.154 --> 00:52:09.784
<v speaker_1>wanna take home

00:52:09.784 --> 00:52:10.464
<v speaker_1>to meet your mother,

00:52:10.464 --> 00:52:11.424
<v speaker_1>not so much

00:52:11.424 --> 00:52:13.004
<v speaker_1>this one." And she

00:52:13.004 --> 00:52:13.764
<v speaker_1>just stopped me

00:52:13.824 --> 00:52:14.604
<v speaker_1>in my tra- I

00:52:14.604 --> 00:52:15.164
<v speaker_1>mean, she was

00:52:15.164 --> 00:52:16.324
<v speaker_1>like, "Just stop and

00:52:16.324 --> 00:52:16.964
<v speaker_1>listen to what

00:52:16.964 --> 00:52:17.664
<v speaker_1>you just said."

00:52:20.044 --> 00:52:20.824
<v speaker_1>She said, "So you

00:52:20.824 --> 00:52:23.064
<v speaker_1>are judging women

00:52:23.064 --> 00:52:24.744
<v speaker_1>like men judge women."

00:52:24.744 --> 00:52:27.184
<v speaker_1>This is what

00:52:27.184 --> 00:52:27.824
<v speaker_1>I'm willing to

00:52:27.824 --> 00:52:28.504
<v speaker_1>take home to meet

00:52:28.504 --> 00:52:29.564
<v speaker_1>my mother. And

00:52:29.564 --> 00:52:31.884
<v speaker_1>I was like, "Okay,

00:52:31.884 --> 00:52:34.344
<v speaker_1>then." [laughs]

00:52:34.344 --> 00:52:35.044
<v speaker_1>Uh, they were very

00:52:35.044 --> 00:52:35.884
<v speaker_1>tough on me,

00:52:35.884 --> 00:52:37.304
<v speaker_1>and I'm so grateful.

00:52:37.304 --> 00:52:38.164
<v speaker_1>It was a,

00:52:38.164 --> 00:52:39.964
<v speaker_1>a NOW organization, National

00:52:39.964 --> 00:52:41.964
<v speaker_1>Organization of Women.

00:52:41.964 --> 00:52:43.164
<v speaker_1>Uh, but... And there

00:52:43.164 --> 00:52:44.204
<v speaker_1>were several lesbians

00:52:44.204 --> 00:52:46.484
<v speaker_1>in that organization. And,

00:52:46.484 --> 00:52:47.104
<v speaker_1>uh, they were

00:52:47.104 --> 00:52:49.124
<v speaker_1>10, 15 years older

00:52:49.124 --> 00:52:50.924
<v speaker_1>than me. Uh,

00:52:50.924 --> 00:52:51.484
<v speaker_1>and they taught me

00:52:51.484 --> 00:52:53.524
<v speaker_1>a lot about

00:52:53.524 --> 00:52:53.824
<v speaker_1>how to be a

00:52:53.824 --> 00:52:54.484
<v speaker_1>lesbian, how to

00:52:54.484 --> 00:52:55.524
<v speaker_1>date. You know, when

00:52:55.524 --> 00:52:56.064
<v speaker_1>your heart gets

00:52:56.064 --> 00:52:56.744
<v speaker_1>broken, I mean, I

00:52:56.744 --> 00:52:57.344
<v speaker_1>really couldn't run

00:52:57.344 --> 00:52:58.064
<v speaker_1>home to mom 'cause

00:52:58.064 --> 00:52:58.664
<v speaker_1>she really wasn't

00:52:58.664 --> 00:52:59.384
<v speaker_1>getting it, you know?

00:52:59.384 --> 00:53:01.784
<v speaker_1>Uh, but other,

00:53:01.784 --> 00:53:02.734
<v speaker_1>these older women could,

00:53:02.734 --> 00:53:04.144
<v speaker_1>so those became

00:53:04.144 --> 00:53:05.884
<v speaker_1>my mentors, my mothers,

00:53:05.884 --> 00:53:08.223
<v speaker_1>my fathers,

00:53:08.223 --> 00:53:09.364
<v speaker_1>um, my brothers and

00:53:09.364 --> 00:53:11.264
<v speaker_1>sisters. Um,

00:53:12.524 --> 00:53:14.084
<v speaker_1>so yeah. So just

00:53:14.084 --> 00:53:14.504
<v speaker_1>keep your head

00:53:14.504 --> 00:53:14.784
<v speaker_1>down.

00:53:17.144 --> 00:53:17.644
<v speaker_1>Try to go to

00:53:17.644 --> 00:53:18.324
<v speaker_1>events if you

00:53:18.324 --> 00:53:19.104
<v speaker_1>can. Get out of

00:53:19.104 --> 00:53:20.444
<v speaker_1>the house and

00:53:20.444 --> 00:53:22.324
<v speaker_1>sneak over to the

00:53:22.324 --> 00:53:23.624
<v speaker_1>Pride Center or

00:53:23.624 --> 00:53:24.484
<v speaker_1>Wellness Center. Go do

00:53:24.484 --> 00:53:26.104
<v speaker_1>that. Uh, sneak

00:53:26.104 --> 00:53:27.024
<v speaker_1>out, come to Pride

00:53:27.024 --> 00:53:28.164
<v speaker_1>Day and the

00:53:28.164 --> 00:53:29.284
<v speaker_1>Pride Parade, if you

00:53:29.284 --> 00:53:29.784
<v speaker_1>have to do

00:53:29.784 --> 00:53:31.184
<v speaker_1>that. Wear a disguise.

00:53:31.184 --> 00:53:32.624
<v speaker_1>We'll protect you.

00:53:32.624 --> 00:53:34.234
<v speaker_1>Um, and it will

00:53:34.234 --> 00:53:35.564
<v speaker_1>get better. It

00:53:35.564 --> 00:53:37.324
<v speaker_1>gets better. You just

00:53:37.324 --> 00:53:38.904
<v speaker_1>gotta stay the

00:53:38.904 --> 00:53:41.124
<v speaker_1>course. It sucks. I

00:53:41.124 --> 00:53:42.164
<v speaker_1>mean, you know,

00:53:43.244 --> 00:53:44.724
<v speaker_1>as I've grown, I've

00:53:44.724 --> 00:53:46.564
<v speaker_1>learned that just

00:53:46.564 --> 00:53:48.534
<v speaker_1>being an adolescent and

00:53:48.534 --> 00:53:49.704
<v speaker_1>a teenager just

00:53:49.704 --> 00:53:51.254
<v speaker_1>sucks in general. Doesn't

00:53:51.254 --> 00:53:52.264
<v speaker_1>matter if you're

00:53:52.264 --> 00:53:53.594
<v speaker_1>straight or gay. It

00:53:53.594 --> 00:53:55.544
<v speaker_1>just sucks. [laughs]

00:53:55.604 --> 00:53:58.004
<v speaker_1>Uh, but, you know,

00:53:58.004 --> 00:53:58.464
<v speaker_1>it sucks a

00:53:58.464 --> 00:53:59.104
<v speaker_1>little bit more for

00:53:59.104 --> 00:54:00.964
<v speaker_1>us, 'cause we

00:54:00.964 --> 00:54:01.964
<v speaker_1>can't really interact. We

00:54:01.964 --> 00:54:03.144
<v speaker_1>don't know things.

00:54:03.144 --> 00:54:05.184
<v speaker_1>Um, find your tribe.

00:54:05.184 --> 00:54:07.264
<v speaker_1>We're here.

00:54:07.264 --> 00:54:08.404
<v speaker_1>Come, be with

00:54:08.404 --> 00:54:10.884
<v speaker_1>us. What else

00:54:10.884 --> 00:54:11.304
<v speaker_1>do you want from

00:54:11.304 --> 00:54:12.644
<v speaker_1>me, Jonathan? [laughs]

00:54:12.644 --> 00:54:13.514
<v speaker_4>I have two questions.

00:54:13.514 --> 00:54:13.624
<v speaker_4>

00:54:13.624 --> 00:54:14.844
<v speaker_1>Sure, yeah. Please.

00:54:14.844 --> 00:54:16.384
<v speaker_4>Um, my first question

00:54:16.384 --> 00:54:17.524
<v speaker_4>is, who taught

00:54:17.524 --> 00:54:17.944
<v speaker_4>you how to ride

00:54:17.944 --> 00:54:18.864
<v speaker_4>a motorcycle, or

00:54:18.864 --> 00:54:19.884
<v speaker_4>did you learn?

00:54:19.884 --> 00:54:20.504
<v speaker_1>Oh, yeah.

00:54:20.504 --> 00:54:21.364
<v speaker_4>And two parts of

00:54:21.364 --> 00:54:22.564
<v speaker_4>that question is,

00:54:22.564 --> 00:54:23.704
<v speaker_4>um, what's your favorite

00:54:23.704 --> 00:54:24.464
<v speaker_4>ride?

00:54:24.464 --> 00:54:26.324
<v speaker_1>Okay. So I got

00:54:26.324 --> 00:54:28.744
<v speaker_1>sober, and my

00:54:28.744 --> 00:54:30.394
<v speaker_1>parents wisely-

00:54:30.394 --> 00:54:32.524
<v speaker_4>Definitely

00:54:32.524 --> 00:54:33.204
<v speaker_1>... took everything away

00:54:33.204 --> 00:54:34.344
<v speaker_1>from me also.

00:54:36.683 --> 00:54:38.824
<v speaker_1>[laughs] [clears throat] So I

00:54:38.824 --> 00:54:39.244
<v speaker_1>get out of

00:54:39.244 --> 00:54:39.884
<v speaker_1>treatment. I went to

00:54:39.884 --> 00:54:41.084
<v speaker_1>treatment, and I

00:54:41.084 --> 00:54:42.504
<v speaker_1>get out, and I

00:54:42.504 --> 00:54:43.024
<v speaker_1>ha- don't have

00:54:43.024 --> 00:54:43.984
<v speaker_1>a vehicle. I have

00:54:43.984 --> 00:54:44.604
<v speaker_1>nothing. You know,

00:54:44.604 --> 00:54:45.113
<v speaker_1>and you really have

00:54:45.113 --> 00:54:45.384
<v speaker_1>to have a

00:54:45.384 --> 00:54:46.524
<v speaker_1>vehicle in Texas, you

00:54:46.524 --> 00:54:48.944
<v speaker_1>know? Uh, so

00:54:48.944 --> 00:54:49.784
<v speaker_1>I got a job.

00:54:49.784 --> 00:54:50.144
<v speaker_1>It was the

00:54:50.144 --> 00:54:51.004
<v speaker_1>best job I could

00:54:51.004 --> 00:54:52.624
<v speaker_1>have ever. Uh,

00:54:52.624 --> 00:54:53.864
<v speaker_1>it was cleaning out

00:54:53.864 --> 00:54:54.944
<v speaker_1>apartments when people

00:54:54.944 --> 00:54:56.808
<v speaker_1>moved out.And then cleaning

00:54:56.808 --> 00:54:57.628
<v speaker_1>them, and so

00:54:57.628 --> 00:54:58.288
<v speaker_1>I could listen to

00:54:58.288 --> 00:54:59.488
<v speaker_1>tapes and AA

00:54:59.488 --> 00:55:00.688
<v speaker_1>stuff and, and clean

00:55:00.688 --> 00:55:01.278
<v speaker_1>these apartments. So

00:55:01.278 --> 00:55:01.528
<v speaker_1>I got a little

00:55:01.528 --> 00:55:01.948
<v speaker_1>bit of money.

00:55:03.248 --> 00:55:03.768
<v speaker_1>And there were these

00:55:03.768 --> 00:55:05.728
<v speaker_1>guys, they were

00:55:05.728 --> 00:55:07.928
<v speaker_1>men, they were biker

00:55:07.928 --> 00:55:09.888
<v speaker_1>men, uh, who

00:55:09.888 --> 00:55:11.028
<v speaker_1>were going to meetings.

00:55:11.028 --> 00:55:12.507
<v speaker_1>Th- they mostly

00:55:12.508 --> 00:55:13.248
<v speaker_1>were... They were like

00:55:13.248 --> 00:55:14.568
<v speaker_1>MC guys, and

00:55:14.568 --> 00:55:15.348
<v speaker_1>they were mostly going

00:55:15.348 --> 00:55:16.308
<v speaker_1>to meetings to

00:55:16.308 --> 00:55:16.768
<v speaker_1>try not to go

00:55:16.768 --> 00:55:18.127
<v speaker_1>to jail. But

00:55:18.128 --> 00:55:18.788
<v speaker_1>I got e- enough

00:55:18.788 --> 00:55:19.588
<v speaker_1>money and I

00:55:19.588 --> 00:55:20.968
<v speaker_1>bought this motorcycle,

00:55:22.248 --> 00:55:22.968
<v speaker_1>and they taught me

00:55:22.968 --> 00:55:23.508
<v speaker_1>how to ride

00:55:23.508 --> 00:55:25.848
<v speaker_1>it. And they scare

00:55:25.848 --> 00:55:26.528
<v speaker_1>me. I still

00:55:26.528 --> 00:55:28.408
<v speaker_1>hear their voices. I

00:55:28.408 --> 00:55:29.048
<v speaker_1>was a little

00:55:29.048 --> 00:55:31.278
<v speaker_1>girl, you know, and

00:55:31.278 --> 00:55:32.368
<v speaker_1>they... I hear

00:55:32.368 --> 00:55:33.948
<v speaker_1>their voices towering over

00:55:33.948 --> 00:55:35.048
<v speaker_1>me. "If we

00:55:35.048 --> 00:55:36.208
<v speaker_1>see you screwing around

00:55:36.208 --> 00:55:37.108
<v speaker_1>or doing stupid

00:55:37.108 --> 00:55:37.988
<v speaker_1>things on this bike,

00:55:37.988 --> 00:55:39.008
<v speaker_1>we will take

00:55:39.008 --> 00:55:39.668
<v speaker_1>it away from you

00:55:39.668 --> 00:55:40.248
<v speaker_1>and leave you

00:55:40.248 --> 00:55:40.728
<v speaker_1>on the side of

00:55:40.728 --> 00:55:42.648
<v speaker_1>the road." And

00:55:42.648 --> 00:55:43.628
<v speaker_1>I was like, "Okay."

00:55:43.628 --> 00:55:44.608
<v speaker_1>[laughs] And I

00:55:44.608 --> 00:55:45.488
<v speaker_1>still hear their voice.

00:55:45.488 --> 00:55:46.248
<v speaker_1>And so that

00:55:46.248 --> 00:55:47.368
<v speaker_1>was my transportation, and

00:55:47.368 --> 00:55:48.488
<v speaker_1>I used... That

00:55:48.488 --> 00:55:49.558
<v speaker_1>was my transportation for

00:55:49.558 --> 00:55:51.868
<v speaker_1>like four years.

00:55:51.868 --> 00:55:52.468
<v speaker_1>That was all I

00:55:52.468 --> 00:55:54.868
<v speaker_1>had. Wind, cold,

00:55:54.868 --> 00:55:56.848
<v speaker_1>wet, didn't matter. That's

00:55:56.848 --> 00:55:58.288
<v speaker_1>what I had.

00:55:58.288 --> 00:55:59.208
<v speaker_1>Uh, later I got

00:55:59.208 --> 00:55:59.967
<v speaker_1>something on four

00:55:59.967 --> 00:56:01.958
<v speaker_1>wheels too. Uh, and

00:56:01.958 --> 00:56:02.408
<v speaker_1>so what is

00:56:02.408 --> 00:56:03.888
<v speaker_1>my favorite ride? The

00:56:03.888 --> 00:56:05.808
<v speaker_1>Three Twisted Sisters.

00:56:07.828 --> 00:56:08.928
<v speaker_1>And I was there

00:56:08.928 --> 00:56:10.928
<v speaker_1>just last week.

00:56:10.928 --> 00:56:11.668
<v speaker_1>Uh, I ride with

00:56:11.668 --> 00:56:12.148
<v speaker_1>a group of

00:56:12.148 --> 00:56:13.868
<v speaker_1>women here called the

00:56:13.868 --> 00:56:14.988
<v speaker_1>Chrome Divas. It's

00:56:14.988 --> 00:56:16.828
<v speaker_1>a national organization.

00:56:16.828 --> 00:56:18.148
<v speaker_1>Uh, we have

00:56:18.148 --> 00:56:19.988
<v speaker_1>a chapter here. Uh,

00:56:19.988 --> 00:56:20.428
<v speaker_1>we don't have

00:56:20.428 --> 00:56:21.218
<v speaker_1>any big rules or

00:56:21.218 --> 00:56:22.088
<v speaker_1>requirements. You don't

00:56:22.088 --> 00:56:22.608
<v speaker_1>even have to own

00:56:22.608 --> 00:56:24.068
<v speaker_1>a motorcycle. Uh,

00:56:24.068 --> 00:56:24.548
<v speaker_1>it's a group of

00:56:24.548 --> 00:56:25.288
<v speaker_1>women who are

00:56:25.288 --> 00:56:27.208
<v speaker_1>motorcycle enthusiasts who promote

00:56:27.208 --> 00:56:28.548
<v speaker_1>safety in motorcycle

00:56:28.548 --> 00:56:30.758
<v speaker_1>riding and do, uh,

00:56:30.758 --> 00:56:32.488
<v speaker_1>non... We do

00:56:32.488 --> 00:56:33.988
<v speaker_1>fundraisers that benefit women

00:56:33.988 --> 00:56:35.138
<v speaker_1>and children nonprofits.

00:56:36.208 --> 00:56:38.068
<v speaker_1>Uh, so it's pretty

00:56:38.068 --> 00:56:39.528
<v speaker_1>cool. And, uh,

00:56:39.528 --> 00:56:40.128
<v speaker_1>and they let me

00:56:40.128 --> 00:56:41.388
<v speaker_1>join. So,

00:56:42.468 --> 00:56:44.148
<v speaker_1>fools. Uh-

00:56:44.148 --> 00:56:44.928
<v speaker_5>What, what do you

00:56:44.928 --> 00:56:45.688
<v speaker_5>like to ride

00:56:45.688 --> 00:56:46.708
<v speaker_5>the best?

00:56:46.708 --> 00:56:47.358
<v speaker_1>I did... I just

00:56:47.358 --> 00:56:48.448
<v speaker_1>said, the, the

00:56:48.448 --> 00:56:50.008
<v speaker_1>sisters, the Twisted Sisters.

00:56:50.008 --> 00:56:50.448
<v speaker_1>

00:56:50.448 --> 00:56:51.348
<v speaker_5>What type of motorcycle?

00:56:51.348 --> 00:56:52.148
<v speaker_5>

00:56:52.208 --> 00:56:53.108
<v speaker_1>Well, of course I

00:56:53.108 --> 00:56:54.058
<v speaker_1>ride a Harley.

00:56:54.058 --> 00:56:54.088
<v speaker_5>[laughs]

00:56:54.088 --> 00:56:56.508
<v speaker_1>I mean, please.

00:56:56.508 --> 00:56:57.468
<v speaker_1>What's your-

00:56:57.468 --> 00:56:58.478
<v speaker_5>The second question is,

00:56:58.478 --> 00:56:59.648
<v speaker_5>could you explain

00:56:59.648 --> 00:57:00.828
<v speaker_5>and dive deeper into

00:57:00.828 --> 00:57:01.848
<v speaker_5>the word dyke

00:57:01.848 --> 00:57:02.668
<v speaker_5>and how it... Like,

00:57:02.668 --> 00:57:04.688
<v speaker_5>do you identify

00:57:04.688 --> 00:57:05.708
<v speaker_5>as that? And also

00:57:05.708 --> 00:57:06.507
<v speaker_5>you mentioned earlier

00:57:06.508 --> 00:57:07.928
<v speaker_5>sometimes it's a slur

00:57:07.928 --> 00:57:09.628
<v speaker_5>and like, what,

00:57:09.628 --> 00:57:09.998
<v speaker_5>what happens all that?

00:57:09.998 --> 00:57:10.088
<v speaker_5>

00:57:10.088 --> 00:57:12.028
<v speaker_1>Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So

00:57:12.028 --> 00:57:12.488
<v speaker_1>back in the

00:57:12.488 --> 00:57:12.857
<v speaker_1>day,

00:57:15.088 --> 00:57:17.088
<v speaker_1>right, straight people used

00:57:17.088 --> 00:57:18.508
<v speaker_1>to yell terms

00:57:18.508 --> 00:57:19.288
<v speaker_1>at us. So for

00:57:19.288 --> 00:57:20.248
<v speaker_1>men, they were

00:57:20.248 --> 00:57:22.228
<v speaker_1>called faggots, right?

00:57:22.228 --> 00:57:23.528
<v speaker_1>And women, they

00:57:23.528 --> 00:57:24.488
<v speaker_1>called us dykes.

00:57:26.168 --> 00:57:27.188
<v speaker_1>You know, we're dykes.

00:57:27.188 --> 00:57:29.488
<v speaker_1>Not... Somebody once

00:57:29.488 --> 00:57:30.628
<v speaker_1>told me that where

00:57:30.628 --> 00:57:32.508
<v speaker_1>that came from,

00:57:32.508 --> 00:57:34.648
<v speaker_1>um, there's a couple

00:57:34.648 --> 00:57:35.568
<v speaker_1>of stories around

00:57:35.568 --> 00:57:36.788
<v speaker_1>it. I like to

00:57:36.788 --> 00:57:38.428
<v speaker_1>think the original,

00:57:38.428 --> 00:57:39.488
<v speaker_1>which is, uh, Judy

00:57:39.488 --> 00:57:40.947
<v speaker_1>Grahn wrote a

00:57:40.948 --> 00:57:43.197
<v speaker_1>book, um, Mother Tongue.

00:57:43.197 --> 00:57:45.128
<v speaker_1>It's very old.

00:57:45.128 --> 00:57:46.088
<v speaker_1>But in it, she

00:57:46.088 --> 00:57:47.268
<v speaker_1>says that dyke

00:57:47.268 --> 00:57:49.618
<v speaker_1>came from Boudica, and

00:57:49.618 --> 00:57:51.548
<v speaker_1>Boudica was a

00:57:51.548 --> 00:57:52.248
<v speaker_1>Celtic

00:57:53.668 --> 00:57:55.748
<v speaker_1>queen who

00:57:55.748 --> 00:57:58.008
<v speaker_1>defeated the Roman

00:57:58.008 --> 00:57:59.948
<v speaker_1>army. And so the

00:57:59.948 --> 00:58:01.608
<v speaker_1>Boudica dyke was

00:58:01.608 --> 00:58:02.528
<v speaker_1>just a shortened term

00:58:02.528 --> 00:58:03.728
<v speaker_1>of that. And

00:58:03.728 --> 00:58:04.388
<v speaker_1>I really could take

00:58:04.388 --> 00:58:05.388
<v speaker_1>that on. I'm

00:58:05.388 --> 00:58:06.508
<v speaker_1>like, "That suits me."

00:58:06.508 --> 00:58:07.728
<v speaker_1>So it was

00:58:07.728 --> 00:58:08.448
<v speaker_1>a slur, though, to

00:58:08.448 --> 00:58:08.928
<v speaker_1>be called a

00:58:08.928 --> 00:58:09.648
<v speaker_1>dyke was like being

00:58:09.648 --> 00:58:11.128
<v speaker_1>called a faggot.

00:58:11.188 --> 00:58:13.028
<v speaker_1>Um, so butch was

00:58:13.028 --> 00:58:15.088
<v speaker_1>something we used,

00:58:15.088 --> 00:58:17.108
<v speaker_1>right? Because we, in

00:58:17.108 --> 00:58:17.828
<v speaker_1>the beginning of

00:58:17.828 --> 00:58:19.628
<v speaker_1>time, we based our

00:58:19.628 --> 00:58:21.988
<v speaker_1>relationships on this

00:58:21.988 --> 00:58:23.608
<v speaker_1>binary thing, right? Of

00:58:23.608 --> 00:58:24.528
<v speaker_1>what men and

00:58:24.528 --> 00:58:25.968
<v speaker_1>women do. That's kind

00:58:25.968 --> 00:58:26.468
<v speaker_1>of how we

00:58:26.468 --> 00:58:28.908
<v speaker_1>structured our relationships.

00:58:28.908 --> 00:58:30.308
<v speaker_1>Y'all did that. We

00:58:30.308 --> 00:58:31.628
<v speaker_1>did that. When

00:58:31.628 --> 00:58:32.488
<v speaker_1>I say y'all, men,

00:58:32.488 --> 00:58:33.108
<v speaker_1>you know, gay

00:58:33.108 --> 00:58:35.488
<v speaker_1>men, lesbians, and that's

00:58:35.488 --> 00:58:36.167
<v speaker_1>how we structured

00:58:36.168 --> 00:58:38.048
<v speaker_1>our relationships. Um,

00:58:38.048 --> 00:58:39.788
<v speaker_1>so, you know,

00:58:39.788 --> 00:58:40.408
<v speaker_1>and a lot of

00:58:40.408 --> 00:58:41.648
<v speaker_1>ti- You know,

00:58:41.648 --> 00:58:42.168
<v speaker_1>y- you really, there

00:58:42.168 --> 00:58:42.768
<v speaker_1>was a time

00:58:42.768 --> 00:58:43.598
<v speaker_1>where you really couldn't

00:58:43.598 --> 00:58:44.548
<v speaker_1>even wear men's

00:58:44.548 --> 00:58:46.788
<v speaker_1>clothing, uh,

00:58:46.788 --> 00:58:47.508
<v speaker_1>to be out in

00:58:47.508 --> 00:58:49.008
<v speaker_1>public. So, you

00:58:49.008 --> 00:58:50.848
<v speaker_1>know, people would change

00:58:50.848 --> 00:58:51.948
<v speaker_1>clothes. Um,

00:58:53.288 --> 00:58:55.688
<v speaker_1>but, so that's where

00:58:55.688 --> 00:58:56.688
<v speaker_1>butch came from.

00:58:56.688 --> 00:58:57.148
<v speaker_1>You know, that was

00:58:57.148 --> 00:58:58.028
<v speaker_1>our term. You

00:58:58.028 --> 00:58:59.248
<v speaker_1>know, I'm butch, fem,

00:58:59.248 --> 00:59:01.508
<v speaker_1>butch, fem. Um-

00:59:01.508 --> 00:59:02.728
<v speaker_4>Do you have a

00:59:02.728 --> 00:59:04.308
<v speaker_4>particular instance where

00:59:04.308 --> 00:59:05.668
<v speaker_4>you were discriminated against

00:59:05.668 --> 00:59:06.608
<v speaker_4>in South Texas?

00:59:10.528 --> 00:59:11.368
<v speaker_1>Oh my God, I

00:59:11.368 --> 00:59:12.088
<v speaker_1>hadn't even thought

00:59:12.088 --> 00:59:13.968
<v speaker_1>about that. [laughs] Um,

00:59:13.968 --> 00:59:13.968
<v speaker_1>

00:59:16.848 --> 00:59:17.767
<v speaker_1>I know that people...

00:59:17.767 --> 00:59:18.308
<v speaker_1>I, I, I

00:59:18.308 --> 00:59:19.788
<v speaker_1>remember being called a

00:59:19.788 --> 00:59:22.148
<v speaker_1>dyke, uh, coming

00:59:22.148 --> 00:59:23.188
<v speaker_1>out of the bars.

00:59:23.188 --> 00:59:25.288
<v speaker_1>If there were

00:59:25.288 --> 00:59:26.968
<v speaker_1>straight people cruising, they'd

00:59:26.968 --> 00:59:27.408
<v speaker_1>call us a

00:59:27.408 --> 00:59:29.108
<v speaker_1>dyke. Um,

00:59:30.168 --> 00:59:32.128
<v speaker_1>but real discrimination, no,

00:59:32.128 --> 00:59:33.388
<v speaker_1>because, you know,

00:59:33.388 --> 00:59:34.588
<v speaker_1>I was younger, I

00:59:34.588 --> 00:59:36.928
<v speaker_1>was prettier, and,

00:59:36.928 --> 00:59:37.928
<v speaker_1>um, 'cause I was

00:59:37.928 --> 00:59:39.048
<v speaker_1>younger. You know,

00:59:39.048 --> 00:59:40.118
<v speaker_1>I was skinnier. You

00:59:40.118 --> 00:59:41.848
<v speaker_1>know. So, you

00:59:41.848 --> 00:59:42.368
<v speaker_1>know, you just kind

00:59:42.368 --> 00:59:43.588
<v speaker_1>of move through.

00:59:43.588 --> 00:59:45.128
<v speaker_1>And it's Texas too.

00:59:45.128 --> 00:59:47.428
<v speaker_1>So, you know,

00:59:47.428 --> 00:59:48.337
<v speaker_1>so many women in

00:59:48.337 --> 00:59:50.028
<v speaker_1>Texas are, you

00:59:50.028 --> 00:59:52.248
<v speaker_1>know, cattle women, uh,

00:59:52.248 --> 00:59:53.428
<v speaker_1>work, you know,

00:59:53.428 --> 00:59:54.308
<v speaker_1>out on the ranches.

00:59:54.308 --> 00:59:54.868
<v speaker_1>I mean, in

00:59:54.868 --> 00:59:55.808
<v speaker_1>these small towns where

00:59:55.808 --> 00:59:56.588
<v speaker_1>I grew up,

00:59:56.588 --> 00:59:58.448
<v speaker_1>you know, everybody, all

00:59:58.448 --> 00:59:58.928
<v speaker_1>the women are

00:59:58.928 --> 00:59:59.928
<v speaker_1>wearing boots and jeans.

00:59:59.928 --> 01:00:01.568
<v speaker_1>We're all doing

01:00:01.568 --> 01:00:03.928
<v speaker_1>that. So wasn't terrible.

01:00:03.928 --> 01:00:06.268
<v speaker_1>Um, no,

01:00:06.268 --> 01:00:06.788
<v speaker_1>I think I

01:00:06.788 --> 01:00:08.008
<v speaker_1>was pretty fortunate around

01:00:08.008 --> 01:00:10.288
<v speaker_1>that. Um, I

01:00:10.348 --> 01:00:10.648
<v speaker_1>know when I went

01:00:10.648 --> 01:00:11.478
<v speaker_1>to New York,

01:00:11.478 --> 01:00:12.008
<v speaker_1>though, when I got

01:00:12.008 --> 01:00:12.628
<v speaker_1>up there,

01:00:14.888 --> 01:00:16.328
<v speaker_1>I didn't realize

01:00:17.508 --> 01:00:19.108
<v speaker_1>how oppressed

01:00:20.228 --> 01:00:21.668
<v speaker_1>I had been here.

01:00:21.668 --> 01:00:21.668
<v speaker_1>

01:00:24.548 --> 01:00:25.988
<v speaker_1>Um, because there, when

01:00:25.988 --> 01:00:27.488
<v speaker_1>I got there

01:00:27.488 --> 01:00:28.208
<v speaker_1>in the mid to

01:00:28.208 --> 01:00:29.888
<v speaker_1>late '80s, people

01:00:29.888 --> 01:00:30.788
<v speaker_1>were just walking around

01:00:30.788 --> 01:00:31.508
<v speaker_1>holding hands with

01:00:31.508 --> 01:00:32.508
<v speaker_1>their girlfriends down the

01:00:32.508 --> 01:00:33.488
<v speaker_1>street. I was

01:00:33.488 --> 01:00:35.108
<v speaker_1>like, "What?

01:00:35.108 --> 01:00:36.548
<v speaker_1>You feel safe

01:00:36.548 --> 01:00:37.448
<v speaker_1>enough to do that?"

01:00:37.448 --> 01:00:38.658
<v speaker_1>Um,

01:00:40.868 --> 01:00:42.168
<v speaker_1>well, I don't feel

01:00:42.168 --> 01:00:44.248
<v speaker_1>that way anymore

01:00:44.248 --> 01:00:45.988
<v speaker_1>here. When we first

01:00:45.988 --> 01:00:47.948
<v speaker_1>came here, I

01:00:47.948 --> 01:00:50.328
<v speaker_1>felt that way back

01:00:50.328 --> 01:00:51.508
<v speaker_1>in 2001. But

01:00:51.508 --> 01:00:51.988
<v speaker_1>we had moved to

01:00:51.988 --> 01:00:52.628
<v speaker_1>a very small

01:00:52.628 --> 01:00:54.008
<v speaker_1>town, and people had

01:00:54.008 --> 01:00:54.388
<v speaker_1>a bunch of

01:00:54.388 --> 01:00:55.578
<v speaker_1>Bible verses out in

01:00:55.578 --> 01:00:56.908
<v speaker_1>their yards. And

01:00:56.908 --> 01:00:57.328
<v speaker_1>I was like, "Oh

01:00:57.328 --> 01:00:57.868
<v speaker_1>my God, what

01:00:57.868 --> 01:00:59.588
<v speaker_1>have I done?" Um,

01:00:59.588 --> 01:01:01.568
<v speaker_1>but

01:01:02.908 --> 01:01:03.428
<v speaker_1>I don't feel that

01:01:03.428 --> 01:01:04.688
<v speaker_1>way now. You

01:01:04.688 --> 01:01:06.008
<v speaker_1>know, I have zero

01:01:06.008 --> 01:01:07.748
<v speaker_1>problem, uh, holding

01:01:07.748 --> 01:01:08.848
<v speaker_1>my wife's hand, kissing

01:01:08.848 --> 01:01:09.448
<v speaker_1>my wife in

01:01:09.448 --> 01:01:11.908
<v speaker_1>public. Uh,

01:01:11.908 --> 01:01:12.928
<v speaker_1>zero problem with that.

01:01:12.928 --> 01:01:13.587
<v speaker_1>You know, I'm

01:01:13.588 --> 01:01:15.808
<v speaker_1>not afraid. And maybe

01:01:15.808 --> 01:01:16.448
<v speaker_1>I should be,

01:01:16.448 --> 01:01:17.228
<v speaker_1>I don't know. But

01:01:17.228 --> 01:01:18.028
<v speaker_1>I'm not.

01:01:20.148 --> 01:01:22.018
<v speaker_1>Bring it. [laughs]

01:01:24.868 --> 01:01:25.868
<v speaker_5>That's all the questions

01:01:25.868 --> 01:01:26.808
<v speaker_5>I had.

01:01:26.808 --> 01:01:27.548
<v speaker_4>Cool. Is there anything

01:01:27.548 --> 01:01:28.128
<v speaker_4>you'd like to

01:01:28.128 --> 01:01:28.528
<v speaker_4>add?

01:01:30.628 --> 01:01:31.368
<v speaker_4>Something that we didn't

01:01:31.368 --> 01:01:32.208
<v speaker_4>talk about?

01:01:32.208 --> 01:01:32.768
<v speaker_1>Be brave.

01:01:36.088 --> 01:01:38.408
<v speaker_1>Be safe. You know,

01:01:38.408 --> 01:01:40.128
<v speaker_1>don't, don't worry

01:01:40.128 --> 01:01:41.268
<v speaker_1>about your blood family.

01:01:41.268 --> 01:01:42.948
<v speaker_1>Find your tribe.

01:01:45.048 --> 01:01:46.488
<v speaker_1>We're here. We are

01:01:46.488 --> 01:01:47.288
<v speaker_1>your tribe. We're

01:01:47.288 --> 01:01:48.088
<v speaker_1>gonna be your family,

01:01:48.088 --> 01:01:50.528
<v speaker_1>and, uh,

01:01:50.528 --> 01:01:51.258
<v speaker_1>and we're gonna take

01:01:51.258 --> 01:01:51.808
<v speaker_1>care of you.

01:01:53.228 --> 01:01:55.648
<v speaker_1>Um, again, I think

01:01:55.648 --> 01:01:57.388
<v speaker_1>that this community

01:01:57.388 --> 01:01:58.528
<v speaker_1>is bigger and more

01:01:58.528 --> 01:02:00.508
<v speaker_1>vibrant, uh,

01:02:00.508 --> 01:02:02.968
<v speaker_1>certainly. And we're continuing

01:02:02.968 --> 01:02:04.528
<v speaker_1>to grow. Um,

01:02:05.588 --> 01:02:07.768
<v speaker_1>so come on. Go

01:02:07.768 --> 01:02:09.108
<v speaker_1>be gay.

01:02:09.108 --> 01:02:11.388
<v speaker_1>[laughs]

01:02:11.388 --> 01:02:12.268
<v speaker_4>Thank you.

01:02:12.268 --> 01:02:13.058
<v speaker_1>You're welcome, Jonathan